Evening all,
Sorry in advance I write a lot.
So buffers are probably the most boring purchase I can fathom, closely followed by tuner pedals, but unfortunately I think I "need" one to fix a problem with my amp.
Backstory w/ amp for anyone interested by curious electronic problems, otherwise skip ahead: copped a sweet '78 Fender Champ for criminal cash on gumtree. Sounds amazing... except for the fact that every single true bypass pedal I have will POP really loudly when I turn them on/off, unless they run into a buffered pedal. I actually just picked it up from JPF amps on Denmark St, who said that he couldn't find anything wrong with the amp. He explained what he thought the problem was but it went over my head somewhat, have emailed him hoping to get a written explanation for a dunce like me as I'd love to understand it. High impedance... DC voltage leakage... I don't know. They're obviously extremely knowledgable and seemed dead sure the amp was fine, and while I'm extremely ignorant, I'm still fairly certain it has to be the amp. Or at the very least some sort of specific and bizarre incompatibility between this amp and true bypass pedals, even if it's ostensibly fine.
There's absolutely no pop whatsoever when I plug into my Roland JC50, and the pop is present but virtually imperceptible going into my Harmony H400C, which is way older than the Champ. I tried isolating each and every pedal on my board just now, and every single true bypass pedal popped really loudly when it was just guitar, pedal and amp. The only ones that didn't were my Flint (when in buffered mode) and the DD-7.
So basically, assuming there is nothing obvious to fix on my amp (which is actually strangely disappointing as it turned out to be a £50 diagnosis for it being perfectly fine - which is both very reassuring and pretty frustrating) then the only fix is to keep a buffered pedal at the end of my chain. Which eliminates all pop completely. Only thing is I defo want my looper last in my chain. The only pedals I'd want after it would be some kind of 'always on' boost type thing or perhaps a reverb, neither of which I have buffered versions of. Would rather not tbh.
SO, my questions:
1. Sadly, I think I need a dedicated buffer. Does anyone have any recommendations? I know they're dead simple little things, but the sheer price discrepancy amongst certain brands is mad and makes me wonder if there's more to them than I'm imagining. There's a Bright Onion one for £30, a gorgeous little Visual Sound one for £50, TC Electronic £55, Analogman £70, Suhr £100... It's madness. Surely they can't be too different? I just need one with a small footprint that won't colour my sound unnecessarily.
2. Not opposed to making my own, I'm learning but I don't know enough about electronics yet to source all my own parts. If anyone has a recommended kit then hit me up. Frank at JPF recommended I get a very specific op-amp if I make my own, but I can't remember it. Any idea what it might have been?
3. Buffer placement. I know they're supposed to go first thing in your signal chain, would there be any negative effects on my tone by keeping a buffer last? Similarly I want to replace my Polytune, which is first in my chain, with a buffered tuner like the Boss Tu-3 (genuinely gassing for that overpriced Waza TU-3... what the heck is wrong with me) - would there be any positive or negative effects from sandwiching all my pedals between two buffers? Currently the DD-7 is the first buffer in my chain which is the 6th pedal in. Tone sounds good, but I wonder if there's a whole new dimension of frequencies that I've been ignoring by not placing a buffer
Bless you if you read all that. Hope one of you electronics buffs (haha!!!) can help me out. Cheers.
Comments
You probably don't need a buffer earlier in the chain if your patch cables are short and high quality.
If it's definitely a DC leakage problem from the amp you could in fact have the amp modified very simply with a large blocking cap at the input to prevent any DC reaching the pedals.
"Take these three items, some WD-40, a vise grip, and a roll of duct tape. Any man worth his salt can fix almost any problem with this stuff alone." - Walt Kowalski
"Only two things are infinite - the universe, and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein
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@ICBM thanks man, it's a good call. But I tried having the DD-7 last for a few days before I took it in for a diagnosis. I agree its often better to delay the loop, but it's currently the only delay on my board, so it felt too limiting to have it last and not being able to play with delay without it affecting whatevers looping.
All my patch cables are short and decent quality, that's good to know. I'll stop lusting after the TU-3w. But a dedicated buffer is still needed for the end I think.
Re. modding the amp. That'd actually solve everything I imagine, but it feels a bit wrong to mod a pristine vintage amp, even if it has issues. Just a bit baffled by it all to be honest. I don't doubt they had a thorough look at it, but I don't really get how there can be popping like this with any and every true bypass pedal without their being some sort of issue. Does every 70s Fender Champ also have this problem then? Seems unlikely.
Not all Fenders do it - it can be a problem caused by conductivity of the eyelet board, which varies from one example to another and is a pet hate of many amp techs because it can be a real pain to properly fix.
If you won't want to use the DD-7, try a Boss FRV-1 Fender Reverb - ideal with that amp .
"Take these three items, some WD-40, a vise grip, and a roll of duct tape. Any man worth his salt can fix almost any problem with this stuff alone." - Walt Kowalski
"Only two things are infinite - the universe, and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein
A good (in engineering terms) buffer can be made with about £15 of parts (at DIY prices) and sold for £30-40 with an appropriate cost for labour. It'll be quiet, clean and do exactly what a buffer should - unity gain, flat frequency response, DC isolation, high input impedance and low output impedance.
However, guitarists in general are an odd bunch, and want things like "CLASS A" in the marketing blurb. Or they don't like chips in the signal chain, so the complexity goes up, they start adding controls so you can make it be not-a-buffer and so on and so forth.
I'm reasonably confident the Bright Onion one is probably one of the most buffery buffers you can get, and the others will be increasingly not-actually-buffers. Incidentally, the Boss pedals aren't great buffers, they have less than unity gain. But they're easily good enough, and you get a pedal into the bargain.
As for position in the signal chain, standard approach is that the front of the chain and the end of the chain are probably the most sensible places to put the things, but really they should go where they're needed. In your application the end of the chain is where the good will be done.
I'm currently using a clone of a Cornish buffer. If you interested in building your own then there is a kit here:
http://shop.pedalparts.co.uk/Cream_Buff_guitar_signal_buffer/p847124_8506552.aspx
I sourced the parts myself and built it on vero board and saved a fiver or so. It's actually in a box with an MXR Microamp clone.
I haven't done a direct AB and it may be a psychological thing but I think it does sound a little better than the Boss one that I used to use (TU3).
The other option is to get a pedal like a Soul Food which is meant to have a decent buffer and doesn't have a huge footprint.
That's also a brilliant trick if you ever need to bias an audio shootout - make the thing you want to win about 0.2dB louder. That's usually just enough to swing the results.
While I would bloody love a Big Sky, I'm woefully short on space at all times, even with a Pedaltrain Novo 24 - so I don't think it's an option unfortunately! Tried the next board up, but it was just way too large.
I'll check out the Cream buffer too, sounds cheap, easy and probably just what I'm looking for.
And Sporky, I do just want a simple buffery buffer! No frills, but it needs to be decent! At this point I'm torn between a kit like the Cornish one, the Bright Onion one (have got a few of their pedals and they do great stuff) and the Visual Sound one purely because it's so incredibly small. Pretty sure anything else would be overkill for me - although I must admit I'm not exactly sure what the functional repercussions of buffers being "increasingly not-actually-buffers" are. You'd assume the opposite given some of their prices.
I think what happens with the not-actually-a-buffer stuff is that people try a buffer, and like what it does (increased sparkle is not uncommon), and think "this'd be even better if it could boost and have tone controls and make sandwiches". Boost and tone control and sandwiches are all good things, but they are not buffer things. Buffers can be made very well for not much money - even if you add in good power supply protection and such.
It's totally impractical for gigging because it's massive and heavy but for recording it's invaluable. It eliminates all hum, hiss and unpleasant noises and adds a lovely richness and complexity to your sound.
I know @Sporky will say that's not what a buffer is for but I don't care what he says when it works so well.
Even more dangerous than riding a bicycle in London.
"Take these three items, some WD-40, a vise grip, and a roll of duct tape. Any man worth his salt can fix almost any problem with this stuff alone." - Walt Kowalski
"Only two things are infinite - the universe, and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein
I run a tuner after my dirt pedals and it works fine.
"Take these three items, some WD-40, a vise grip, and a roll of duct tape. Any man worth his salt can fix almost any problem with this stuff alone." - Walt Kowalski
"Only two things are infinite - the universe, and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein