Not a criminal matter

Drew_TNBD · June 2017

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-nottinghamshire-40420511

digitalscream · June 2017

I have no words.

guitarfishbay · June 2017

Yeah this is a terrible situation.

I do think this issue needs proper discussion and not just being shot down by people who cite genuine examples for medically necessary circumcision, or that it didn't affect them/their friend etc...... if it's not needed medically then it should be a choice, and a choice made by the person themselves

digitalscream · June 2017

guitarfishbay said:

Yeah this is a terrible situation.

I do think this issue needs proper discussion and not just being shot down by people who cite genuine examples for medically necessary circumcision, or that it didn't affect them/their friend etc...... if it's not needed medically then it should be a choice, and a choice made by the person themselves

That argument drives me nuts. A laryngectomy can be "medically necessary", but it's not something you'd willingly have done to your three month old child just because a dusty old book says you should.

guitarfishbay · June 2017

Exactly.

Just because it's sometimes necessary doesn't mean it's always justifiable.

Winny_Pooh · June 2017

That article is missing the full story. Where and how did this happen? Is the mother shifting blame from the grandparents to the medical staff? (that'd be incredibly shitty if so)

digitalscream · June 2017

Winny_Pooh said:

That article is missing the full story. Where and how did this happen? Is the mother shifting blame from the grandparents to the medical staff? (that'd be incredibly shitty if so)

My reading of it is that no medical staff were involved - at least, not in an official medical capacity, given that the 61yr old is "thought to be a doctor" - which is supported by the fact that it appears to have been a botched job.

In any case, even if the guy who did it is a doctor, he's totally failed in his responsibilities by not seeking the parents' consent, and thus he's culpable anyway (and should be struck off if he's a real doctor).

CabbageCat · June 2017

Reminds me of the time when my friend left her toddler daughter with her grandparents for a day and the kid was returned with a fringe!! I shudder from the memory.

digitalscream · June 2017

I still don't get these religious types' obsession with circumcision. I mean...every holy book says that man was created in their god's image, and is therefore perfect. Therefore, a) you can't improve on "perfect", and b) surely it must be sacrilege to take such a "perfect" work and then start cutting bits off?

Teetonetal · June 2017

digitalscream said:

Winny_Pooh said:

That article is missing the full story. Where and how did this happen? Is the mother shifting blame from the grandparents to the medical staff? (that'd be incredibly shitty if so)

My reading of it is that no medical staff were involved - at least, not in an official medical capacity, given that the 61yr old is "thought to be a doctor" - which is supported by the fact that it appears to have been a botched job.

In any case, even if the guy who did it is a doctor, he's totally failed in his responsibilities by not seeking the parents' consent, and thus he's culpable anyway (and should be struck off if he's a real doctor).

I read it as:
Kid left with grand parents
Grand parents get kid circumcised without parental consent
Mother (rightly) furious.

how would this be treated if it was a hand or a foot etc. That it's not considered GBH is quite frankly abhorrent.
In my opinion only genuine medical reasons should be considered. Religious regions can fuck off.

Chalky · June 2017

Any discussion on circumcision soon runs into facile arguments about health benefits then descends into accusations of anti-semitism.

Like FGM, it is an evil practice with no place in the modern world.

digitalscream · June 2017

Chalky said:

Any discussion on circumcision soon runs into facile arguments about health benefits then descends into accusations of anti-semitism.

Like FGM, it is an evil practice with no place in the modern world.

Indeed. Contrary to my initial response, it turns out that I have lots of words about this.

Bidley · June 2017

I've been guilty of the whole medical argument (I was circumcised for medical reasons), but this is horrific. It genuinely sickens me.

Kalimna · June 2017

There are certainly situations that circumcision is required medicaly, but this is not one of them. I am somewhat to the right of Mr Dawkins when it comes to religion - an out-dated philosophy of how the world around us works - but religiously motivated body 'adjustment' to those unable to comprehend/vocalise consent is nothing short of abhorrent. Whether there was parental consent or not.

In this case, and apologies if I missed it in the article, there was no mention of the father. It is, therefore, possible that the father was present and *did* give consent, which would have made this legal, if not morally comfortable.

Adam

CabbageCat · June 2017

Kalimna said:

There are certainly situations that circumcision is required medicaly, but this is not one of them. I am somewhat to the right of Mr Dawkins when it comes to religion - an out-dated philosophy of how the world around us works - but religiously motivated body 'adjustment' to those unable to comprehend/vocalise consent is nothing short of abhorrent. Whether there was parental consent or not.

Or any culturally-motivated impositions on children's personages. I cringe when I see toddlers with pierced ears.

Kalimna · June 2017

Agreed. There is a 5 year old boy in my youngests' nursery group with a teeny ear piercing. Again, an abhorrent fashion statement.

professorben · June 2017

There you go, religious people are fucking nutters.

Ban it all right now.

professorben · June 2017

Teetonetal said:

digitalscream said:

Winny_Pooh said:

That article is missing the full story. Where and how did this happen? Is the mother shifting blame from the grandparents to the medical staff? (that'd be incredibly shitty if so)

My reading of it is that no medical staff were involved - at least, not in an official medical capacity, given that the 61yr old is "thought to be a doctor" - which is supported by the fact that it appears to have been a botched job.

In any case, even if the guy who did it is a doctor, he's totally failed in his responsibilities by not seeking the parents' consent, and thus he's culpable anyway (and should be struck off if he's a real doctor).

I read it as:
Kid left with grand parents
Grand parents get kid circumcised without parental consent
Mother (rightly) furious.

how would this be treated if it was a hand or a foot etc. That it's not considered GBH is quite frankly abhorrent.
In my opinion only genuine medical reasons should be considered. Religious regions can fuck off.

I wonder how many grandparents would see jail time if they cut off his little finger, or pulled out all his fingernails.

Monsters that need to be put away.

Octafish · June 2017

...but, but, but the sky fairies said it was ok!

Seriously the grandparents should be prevented from having any contact with any children, it's a safegaurding issue at the minimum.

professorben · June 2017

Octafish said:

...but, but, but the sky fairies said it was ok!

Seriously the grandparents should be prevented from having any contact with any children, it's a safegaurding issue at the minimum.

Yep, the golden monkey god that lives in the cupboard said it was ok to chop bits off babies.......

Would it be possible to subject the grandfather to a reverse circumcision??

take a skin graft from say...... his scalp and surgically attach it to his knob.

Dickhead

Kalimna · June 2017

Would it be harsh to suggest a skin graft derived from pig cells?

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