Pitfalls of buying first guitar upgrade?

Paul7926 · October 2018

Hi

As my first post here gave me so much good advice and opinion I thought I'd try again with my second dilemma.

I'm starting to look at buying my first guitar upgrade. Now life has thrown me a few curve balls so it's further away than I thought it was a month ago but that's OK as there are some things that I need to figure out.

One of the things that I've come to understand is vitally important is to play what you are considering buying. Whatever it's technical specifications the feel of it coupled with the aesthetics are major factors which can only really be tested 'in the flesh'.

Now this is where I'm starting to struggle.

I have two local music shops.

One is very large and carries all sorts musical equipment and has a decent size guitar section. It tends to carry more stock aimed at the beginner than anything else and it's actually where I got my first Epi from. It doesn't have that much choice in intermediate or expensive guitars and also seems to be more focused on Fender/Ibanez than anything else. Nothing wrong with that but having had a look around there isn't really that much in there that makes me go 'wow' when I see it on the wall.

The other is a much smaller shop that seems to manage to exist locally by catering for the other end of the spectrum. They don't have a huge stock but what they do have all look very nice. They have more PRS than anything but we are talking the price end of the PRS range that I'll never be able to afford/justify. I think maybe because they cater for the more expensive end of the market and seem to be generally well thought of by the local gigging musicians they do have a large second hand section. This does at least mean that something I'm interested in might turn up there from time to time.

So how do people without a convenient local shop go about trying out guitars? Do you plan a day trip to somewhere where you know carries the sort of stock your interested in? Do you buy mail order and if so what happens when you open the box and despite having arrived in perfect condition that new guitar just isn't what you want when you get it?

For a secondary question how good do you need to be to actually play something in a shop that just doesn't make you look like a complete idiot? Despite wanting a better guitar I'm still very very new to all this so it's not like I can turn up and knock out a few covers or complicated solo's on anything! It's part of what scares me about going to the small shop with the second hand selection. I know it's a place that 'real' musicians frequent and I certainly don't belong in that category. That's not to say anything about the actual staff in there as I've never quite had the guts to go through the door. They may be great about it all I just don't know!

Tenebrous · October 2018

First of all, don't be worried about going into the shop & playing like a beginner. Every single person in that shop who plays the instrument started off the exact same way you did, & the kinda person who'd laugh at someone developing a passion for what they themselves love are the kinda people you needn't bother yourself with anyway.

(Just don't play Seven Nation Army/Smoke on the Water/Stairway to Heaven, etc

)

I order online myself, but that's only because I've a very select idea of what I want, & I'm experienced enough at this point to know what's likely to be good before ordering it (through research, experience with similar models, hardware, etc). My advice would be go to any shop you can, try out all the gear you can, and find something you really like the feel of - Even if it's out of your budget. Then you can take that knowledge & apply it to similar models online that might be cheaper, second hand models, etc.

Whatever the case, make sure you go into that smaller shop & keep an eye on the second hand section like you mentioned!

Guitar_Slinger · October 2018

Hi @Paul7926. ; What do you mean by first guitar upgrade?

Paul7926 · October 2018

Guitar_Slinger said:

Hi @Paul7926. ; What do you mean by first guitar upgrade?

To be fair it's not something I need but the logic is simply this:

I was very afraid of this being a 'fad' so I picked up an Epiphone SG special which I think coast me £130. I figured that if I gave up after a month then I would not have wasted too much money. For the price it's a fantastic little guitar and I probably don't need anything better. It holds it's tuning reasonably well, it's not got an awful action on it. It does however have some issues that are perfectly acceptable for such a cheap instrument. The mechanical parts like the tuners and the switches are ok but are certainly not going to last forever. The pickups are OK but in reality there isn't much difference no matter what configuration you select. I'm not knocking it as it's been great for me and as I said, in reality, I probably don't need anything better given my standard of playing. When I was looking at new guitars the wife actually said "but you can't play the one you got".

Now I'm 9 months down the line and whilst progress has not been rapid (I'm old) there has been enough that I'm going to plod along and just see how much I can learn. I've got a great tutor, reasonable expectations of my ability and I'm not going to be giving up. So I'm on the lookout for something that's a little more polished and can be 'my' guitar, perhaps forever. I've got a much better idea of what I'm after and I don't want to keep doing minor upgrades over the next few years. So I figured that if I were to be looking in perhaps the £500 ballpark, especially second hand, I could get something quite nice that will last me. Even if later down the line I start contemplating new pups or tuners or whatever I should at least have a body that it's worth doing those things to.

So I'm looking for something that I would say is not an 'entry level' guitar but I'm never going to be able to afford or justify the higher price instruments that I see in the classifieds here. I am however going to be spending enough that I don't want to just be taking a 'punt' on something from an online retailer as I want to at least make sure simple, non musical things, like the weight and the neck feel 'right' to me.

LuttiS · October 2018

I would get down to the music shops and try everything. From the sounds of it (correct me if i'm wrong) you've only played the SG - so go and try all the other shapes and builds of guitar. Once you find out what kind of shape is for you then you can narrow it down.

You may have a shape in mind that your guitar heroes play and you want, but do try others too.. a lot of my favourite artists for example have Les Pauls, but i just don't get on with them...

Also don't be swayed by brand and things.. as you have said you've only recently gotten serious about this, so you've probably got a fair idea of the major brands i.e. fender, gibson, PRS etc. But don't discount other makes too because you haven't heard of them.

Good luck!

Paul7926 · October 2018

LuttiS said:

I would get down to the music shops and try everything. From the sounds of it (correct me if i'm wrong) you've only played the SG - so go and try all the other shapes and builds of guitar. Once you find out what kind of shape is for you then you can narrow it down.

You may have a shape in mind that your guitar heroes play and you want, but do try others too.. a lot of my favourite artists for example have Les Pauls, but i just don't get on with them...

Also don't be swayed by brand and things.. as you have said you've only recently gotten serious about this, so you've probably got a fair idea of the major brands i.e. fender, gibson, PRS etc. But don't discount other makes too because you haven't heard of them.

Good luck!

Yeah I've only played my Epi SG. I've held a Gibson LP (took it off the wall for a look see) but as it was more moniez than I was going to spend I never actually asked to play it. I most certainly do have an idea in mind but I do think trying things outside that idea will be very useful as well.

Tenebrous · October 2018

In addition to what LuttiS said, you mentioned having a tutor: Ask him to go with you! It's great having a more experienced head around for things like this.

kt66 · October 2018

Paul7926 said:

Hi

So how do people without a convenient local shop go about trying out guitars? Do you plan a day trip to somewhere where you know carries the sort of stock your interested in? Do you buy mail order and if so what happens when you open the box and despite having arrived in perfect condition that new guitar just isn't what you want when you get it?

For a secondary question how good do you need to be to actually play something in a shop that just doesn't make you look like a complete idiot? Despite wanting a better guitar I'm still very very new to all this so it's not like I can turn up and knock out a few covers or complicated solo's on anything! It's part of what scares me about going to the small shop with the second hand selection. I know it's a place that 'real' musicians frequent and I certainly don't belong in that category. That's not to say anything about the actual staff in there as I've never quite had the guts to go through the door. They may be great about it all I just don't know!

I only buy from local shops or head into central london or drive to Epsom or Brighton - I live in SE London so a couple of local shops I can use. I have always played a guitar before buying it. I can't imagine doing it any other way.

I am a terrible guitar player, but I just play chords and odd riff, don't care if people listen and laugh. I check for straight neck, good intonation, low first fret action. I get the shop to adjust to how I like it there and then, this also tells me if the truss rod works or not.

WiWi · October 2018

Paul, I think we've all been there. I would say buy what you want, if its your new passion you should feed it!
About the guitar shops, I think the hardest part is going through the door and asking someone if you can try some guitars. Once you get going the time will fly by and you'll have a much better idea of whats available. Don't feel like you have to buy anything there and then and don't feel guilty for walking out empty handed, guitar shops are used to this, they want to make a sale but they're musicians too and understand your situation, they've been there too. In fact I would recommend not buying anything on your first trip, there's a lot of information to take in, go home and think about it all for a while, there's no rush.
Worst case scenario: You make some people you'll never see again feel good about how far along their playing has come! And if the guitar ends up being a mistake you can sell it on and probably not lose much anyway, it's all part of the journey.

Paul7926 · October 2018

kt66 said:

Paul7926 said:

Hi

So how do people without a convenient local shop go about trying out guitars? Do you plan a day trip to somewhere where you know carries the sort of stock your interested in? Do you buy mail order and if so what happens when you open the box and despite having arrived in perfect condition that new guitar just isn't what you want when you get it?

For a secondary question how good do you need to be to actually play something in a shop that just doesn't make you look like a complete idiot? Despite wanting a better guitar I'm still very very new to all this so it's not like I can turn up and knock out a few covers or complicated solo's on anything! It's part of what scares me about going to the small shop with the second hand selection. I know it's a place that 'real' musicians frequent and I certainly don't belong in that category. That's not to say anything about the actual staff in there as I've never quite had the guts to go through the door. They may be great about it all I just don't know!

I only buy from local shops or head into central london or drive to Epsom or Brighton - I live in SE London so a couple of local shops I can use. I have always played a guitar before buying it. I can't imagine doing it any other way.

I am a terrible guitar player, but I just play chords and odd riff, don't care if people listen and laugh. I check for straight neck, good intonation, low first fret action. I get the shop to adjust to how I like it there and then, this also tells me if the truss rod works or not.

Thanks. I've managed to read enough articles and watch enough youtube vids that I feel confident enough to do the mechanical checks (I'm not going to spot a good fake but hopefully will spot neck problems, unusual wear, signs of bad repairs, etc). I'm just not going to be very musical

munckee · October 2018

Absolute music is decent in Poole o bought a used fender strat in there around the 500 mark and they properly set up all guitars.

There is is a guitar shop in Southampton the name of which I can't remember but they have a pretty good range. I would certainly advocate buying used and I think used on here is safer than eBay or gumtree although I have used both successfully.

The benefit fit of second hand from here is whatever you buy should be worth what you paid when you inevitably want to trade up again

pmbomb · October 2018

I probably don't need anything better given my standard of playing. When I was looking at new guitars the wife actually said "but you can't play the one you got"

you deserve the best you can get/afford/desire. being a beginner is not relevant to that, if anything it makes it more important. beginning is a special time. your wife has the cart before the horse.

I'm 2 years in and my opinion is

1) buy second hand as depreciation on new guitars is brutal (so avoiding it means you can move it on without a big loss if you buy well). I also think guitars with a bit of wear and tear are cooler, and you won't stress about adding the odd mark either.

2) don't expect to get it right first time, it takes time to get into the groove with a new guitar. (hence point 1, minimise the risk rather than fret about trying to find 'the one').

3) buy something you think is sexy, because the absolutely most important attribute it has to have is you want to pick it up every day.

how to do 1) ? Most sellers on here are sound (check they have a posting history other than on Classifieds, and read what they write, get a feel for the person). Some guitars have been bought and sold more than once, it doesn't mean there's anything wrong with them.

My Les Paul came from ebay but a few emails back and forth with the seller made it obvious he was an honest guy and a player not a flipper. There's a degree of risk of course, but I balance that against my PRS which I bought new, decided isn't really my bag and will take a 50% hit on when someone buys it.

(& I do like Les Pauls).

hth.

rico · October 2018

My advice to guitarists looking to take up the guitar or upgrade is to choose a guitar you think looks cool as fuck. Our little game is all about inspiration so if you aren't inspired by the guitar you're playing, you're off to a false start.

If you generally like the SG shape, I would try and look for a lower end Gibson SG and factor in some cash for a good set up.

mburekenge · October 2018

When I was looking at new guitars the wife actually said "but you can't play the one you got".

sounds like a keeper

Paul7926 · October 2018

mburekenge said:

When I was looking at new guitars the wife actually said "but you can't play the one you got".

sounds like a keeper

To be fair to her it was a flippant comment and she wouldn't veto the purchase of a new one as long as the bills are all paid first. My flippant response was "but the next one might be different".

My biggest success so far was about a month ago when I was noodling around with a simplified version of 'Wishing Well' from the RSL grade 1 book and she poked her head around the living room door to say "I actually recognise that".

DB1 · October 2018

She didn't say what she recognised it as though. ;-) On that subject, last New Year's Eve daytime, I was selling a thinline Tele, and a chap came over with his wife to my office to buy it. He asked me to demo it as he didn't really play, so I thought I'd pick something appropriate to the guitar and the time of year.

It just happened that I'd been learning a Kenny Burrell chord melody version of White Christmas, so I played that for him. He looked at his wife afterwards and said, 'that was fantastic. It's my favourite song of all time'..........

'Somewhere Over The Rainbow'

Bastard.

Paul7926 · October 2018

rico said:

My advice to guitarists looking to take up the guitar or upgrade is to choose a guitar you think looks cool as fuck. Our little game is all about inspiration so if you aren't inspired by the guitar you're playing, you're off to a false start.

If you generally like the SG shape, I would try and look for a lower end Gibson SG and factor in some cash for a good set up.

Yeah, I've noticed that second hand Gibson SG specials seem to fall within my imposed budget.

Shrews · October 2018

@DB1 ;

LOL

You should probably have sung the first line to give them a clue.

pmbomb · October 2018

Paul7926 said:

rico said:

My advice to guitarists looking to take up the guitar or upgrade is to choose a guitar you think looks cool as fuck. Our little game is all about inspiration so if you aren't inspired by the guitar you're playing, you're off to a false start.

If you generally like the SG shape, I would try and look for a lower end Gibson SG and factor in some cash for a good set up.

Yeah, I've noticed that second hand Gibson SG specials seem to fall within my imposed budget.

lol sounds to me like you've already decided!

Alvin · October 2018

You don't have to plug a guitar in to try it . Are you trying hearing the amp or the guitar ? Personally i think the feel is the most important part . It is easy to be influenced an amp you are trying it through . If i try a new guitar i always try it unplugged for a while first , i just think i get a better feel for it that way .

We have all done what you are thinking about and any shop that that looks down on beginers isn't worth going in to , as many have said we have all been there .

Paul7926 · October 2018

pmbomb said:

Paul7926 said:

rico said:

My advice to guitarists looking to take up the guitar or upgrade is to choose a guitar you think looks cool as fuck. Our little game is all about inspiration so if you aren't inspired by the guitar you're playing, you're off to a false start.

If you generally like the SG shape, I would try and look for a lower end Gibson SG and factor in some cash for a good set up.

Yeah, I've noticed that second hand Gibson SG specials seem to fall within my imposed budget.

lol sounds to me like you've already decided!

Well yes and no. It's most certainly the first avenue of investigation however I'm going to be sensible enough to walk away from the idea if it doesn't feel right or something else feels better. I'm looking at the imposed delay as an opportunity to look around and do some research.

I think my biggest take away from all this is that I need to conquer my fears and go and try some stuff, even if it's not initially on my short list. I can't do a comparison without doing the groundwork to have things to compare.

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Pitfalls of buying first guitar upgrade?

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