Gordon Smith and Richard's Guitars

JookyChap

I know Richard from Richard's Guitars in Stratford isn't everybody's cuppa, but he has been a big supporter of Gordon Smith - so this was sad to read..

Myself, I've only played a handful of their newer guitars and not been impressed compared to the old 'uns, but have never been sure whether it is fake nostalia or just that older wood sounds better etc.

frankus

Good for him

impmann

Yes but remember that Richard is a drama queen of epic proportions and isn't exactly spotless in his business dealings.
I'd like to see the other side of the argument, as there's probably more to this than meets the eye.

WezV

Got to laugh at the hair in the finish.  I once heard a report from a customer that GS had refused to do him a white finish as it was too difficult to keep particles out during the finishing process

ESBlonde

Yes to the quality issues, not acceptable on a £1.5k guitar that is effectively hand made. But the comment about not paying to terms means he's not always supported GS in the financial sense. Harsh maybe and the world is a cruel place especially in the current economic climate, but that said little businesses like GS need cash too otherwise they have to pass on substandard production rather than take the bullet.

I admire Richards stance on quality, I fear he may not fit into the world of mass guitar sales against the internet resellers who offer quantity over quality.

I wish Richard and Gordon Smith success in their business ventures, not sure I would want to be in ethers boots right now.

martinw

Doesn't surprise me. GS have always had iffy quality.

I've had 2, bought new from Sounds Great.

I noticed on one of them that the frets weren't square to the guitar. I checked and they were square to the edge of the fretboard, and at a visible angle to the nut!

I took it back, and me and the guy in the shop checked all the 7-8 GS guitars they had in stock, and they split about 50/50: some had frets that were square to the guitar's centreline (as normal) and some had frets square to the edge of the fretboard.

He rang JS about it and was basically fobbed off.

:-O

grungebob

No idea who the chap is or have a comment on pay terms etc, but those finish issues I wouldn't accept on a £200 Indonesian squire let alone a £1k plus guitar.

draftrabbit

I remember buying My 2nd Guitar from Richard At Regent's it was literally the Crappiest Xcort X6 Type 2 with Floyd I have ever Purchased, Not his fault at all I was young it was black and it sounded pretty ok I HAD TO HAVE IT!

Gone are the days of Mom and Pop Guitar shops where that Prized Fender (Read Metal monster) sits in a corner begging me to buy it,

It's a shame almost every guitar I've had in recent years has gone back due to some issue.

The Lacquer on my Custom Shop Epiphone was awful!

He just needs to get in good with Rob chappers His ML guitars are absolutely lovely.

ICBM

I've never understood why Gordon-Smith have the reputation they seem to have for being good. They've always been poorly-finished, used cheap cost-cutting construction methods, and in some cases have design flaws which result in problems later even if not to begin with.

I know that will upset some people, sorry.

DeeTee

ICBM said:

I've never understood why Gordon-Smith have the reputation they seem to have for being good. They've always been poorly-finished, used cheap cost-cutting construction methods, and in some cases have design flaws which result in problems later even if not to begin with.

I know that will upset some people, sorry.

Not at all. They've always felt a little plastic to me as well. I've played a couple of good ones, but a lot of wrong 'uns. A guy in Oxford used to pitch them to anyone who walked in the shop, so I tried a few.

Bogwhoppit

ESBlonde said:

 

I admire Richards stance on quality

That in itself endears me to consider buying from the man.

I was accused of being too fussy because I found dings on a new Les Paul unacceptable .

Regardless if there are ten sides to this story, if those pictures represent real guitars, then that is shoddy workmanship and will reflect back on the dealer.

chrisj1602

I played a couple in Sounds Great a few years back, I liked them but they were the satin finished, lower end models.  I think i'd be tempted by one of the LP Junior types, especially at some of the used prices i've seen, but if I was looking for a high end custom order, a GS wouldn't even enter my head.

OilCityPickups

I've had a few GS guitars throught the workshop over the years, and they are indeed rather inconsistent in their quality control. Richard's motives and relative 'excitability' aside, one has a right to expect a pretty well perfect guitar for £1500. I'm obviously a massive champion of UK businesses, but other small guitar building outfits seem to be able to get it right ... so perhaps GS needs to pull it's knickers up.

DeeTee

Bogwhoppit said:

Regardless if there are ten sides to this story, if those pictures represent real guitars, then that is shoddy workmanship and will reflect back on the dealer.

This. Although anyone not paying to schedule is a pain, as @theGuitarWeasel says, a hair in the lacquer is unacceptable. I'd be unhappy with it on a £300 guitar, but £1600? I'd be livid.

EricTheWeary

ICBM said:

I've never understood why Gordon-Smith have the reputation they seem to have for being good. They've always been poorly-finished, used cheap cost-cutting construction methods, and in some cases have design flaws which result in problems later even if not to begin with.

I know that will upset some people, sorry.

I guess they looked better VFM when they started out 25 years ago against the Gibsons of the time. Some of them had no problems or had their problems sorted and got picked up second hand for tuppence so they gained a more positive reputation in that way. Some people like to buy British. There weren't that many custom makers around and a GS would have been relatively cheap and available compared to most from the ground up customs.

I think though, like the chap in the OP's link,I like the idea of GS more than I want to pay for one of their guitars.The problem for Richards Guitars in dropping GS is that they lose some of the individual character of why you might want to go there rather than to GuitarGuitar or PMT and this may be shooting themselves in the foot somewhat.

stickyfiddle

I haven't played many, but every GS I've played has been dull and tbh a bit amateur-hour in its finishing.

I like Rich. I know he has his critics but I've always found him to be completely up-front and honest about everything, even if he gets a bit over-zealous at times.

Panama_Jack666

Just echoing what others have said. Regardless of how many sides to the story there is, unfortunately, pictures speak a thousand words. The quality control on those guitars is terrible.

If what Rich has said is true, I find it astonishing GS would let a product leave his hands with that level of finish, with his name tied to it. If the finish was that bad on the visible bits, what about the parts you can't see?!

I don't know Rich but I get the impression he just ones to sell good products and just wants the best for his customers.

OilCityPickups

I always liked the plain, no frills GS1 ...at least I liked the idea of it. The trouble is the execution has always been a let them down a bit. An Epiphone LP Junior, or a PRS SE One will actually be as good if not better instrument. Now I will have to face washing my mouth out with soap and water for praising a PRS .... damn you all!

Adam_MD

TheGuitarWeasel;101348" said:

I always liked the plain, no frills GS1 ...at least I liked the idea of it. The trouble is the execution has always been a let them down a bit. An Epiphone LP Junior, or a PRS SE One will actually be as good if not better instrument. Now I will have to face washing my mouth out with soap and water for praising a PRS .... damn you all!

You better watch it that's the third time I've read you being nice about PRS. It's about time you came out of the closet and admitted you like them. It's ok no one here will judge you... maybe

digitalscream

EricTheWeary said:

I like the idea of GS more than I want to pay for one of their guitars.

That's pretty much it in a nutshell. My first guitar teacher had a GS1, and it was a sodding fantastic guitar - he's still got it, and to this day is stands up well against all of his crazy-expensive Ibanez Prestiges (including his own sig model). Apart from that and one other (one my dad picked up with a Squier Tele for £250 the pair), they've all been dogs or had enough irritations to put me off.

Stupid thing is, I still want a bare-finish GS1.

not_the_dj

Richard's been selling GS guitars for years, so this really is a big step....but his philosophy has always been to sell a quality product that he himself would recomend as opposed to making sales targets and big bucks. A very brave (possibly foolish?) stance in this economic climate for a small independant shop.

I remember trying a GS1 in his former shop in Leamington, he was so enthusiastic about the brand, but the guitar really didn't click with me and I couldn't see what all the fuss was about, felt and looked cheap, and those issues he's highlighted with an expensive model are shocking.