I was looking at getting a new amp and I've always fancied a Fender '65 Twin Reverb reissue. During my searches, I came across the Tone Master amps. Has anyone had experience of them and how do they compare to the real tube version? As far as I can tell, the only difference between the Deluxe Reverb and Twin Reverb is the number of speakers - is that right? The amp will be mostly, if not entirely, for home practice (although I'm lucky enough to have a separate room where I don't have to be particularly quiet). Would I be right to assume that a 1x12 will be more than enough, or is there something else that the Twin adds over and above more volume?
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The difference between Deluxe and Twin is the same as on the valve versions - 2 speakers and more volume are the most obvious, but the Twin also gains Middle controls and Bright switch for each channel, and feels a little bit different (bigger and cleaner is how I'd describe it). The Deluxe is certainly plenty of volume for home use, but it's worth trying both if you've never tried either before, either TM or valve versions. I love the Deluxe and have never got on with Twins as much.
If the answer is no then I'd get either a custom deluxe Princeton or Deluxe reverb, and possibly an attenuator for home use. I say this as someone who has both a Helix and a couple of valve amps.
The reason I'd go for the "real" amp isn't to do with the sound, it's to do with the fact that in 20 years time my valve amps will both very likely be working perfectly (and if not will probably be easily repairable). I had a 50 year old Orange which worked perfectly once I spent about £150 on a major service/overhaul.
If a modelling amp breaks it's much less likely to be repairable. It will also, no matter how good the digital modelling tech is now, be "obsolete" in 10 years or less.
Digital modelling is very very good these days, but I still regard the Helix as something that will last for 5 out 10 years and then be replaced. My handwired MJW will likely last a lifetime.
If it's just for home practice I honestly wouldn't bother with either of the bigger options. The Twin on particular is big and very loud on anything approaching the full power mode.
The DR will be break up more than the Twin… imowned both together and would recommend unreservedly the DR.
The attenuator works extremely well from whisper quiet and all the points in between.
I only play at home and an odd jam with another home player and it takes pedals extremely well.
It'll become like watches. There's really no need for a mechanical watch to exist at all, but that doesn't stop them being very desirable within enthusiast circles.
The arrival of quartz has similarly reduced the number of master clockmakers, but those that remain generally charge more.
Valve amps have a lot of inherent advantages. A good one will sound really good, and apart from the valves they're physically robust, they generally use fairly simple circuits which are easy to repair, and can last 50+ years with very little attention beyond capacitor maintenance/replacement.
My Helix if it breaks is likely to be impractical to repair and in any case something with more processing power, more models and better UI will come along and replace it. It was also made in a large factory in China where I imagine if I had to work there I would find the working conditions miserable, in contrast to my MJW which was built locally
It's quiet enough to plat at home using the power scaling, it's plenty powerful to play out with whether you want clean or a bit of break up and the sound is absolutely close enough as soon as you're playing with anyone else. Add all of that and the fact that I can carry it one handed to the pub and it's a winner
Does it sound 100% the same, no, does it sound good? Yes, it only amplifies what you put in...
I don't think there's a better option for price/sound/versatility/weight/aesthetic.
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Modern techs like I see on YT (I don't actually know anyone who actually fixes at component level other than myself locally) are more focussed on one product. There are amp guys who are brilliant, but they don't tend to work on digital SM stuff. Then there are guys who are great on SM digital stuff but they won't work on something like a valve amp generally. Too big and not enough money in it.
So the electronics repair trade is more focussed in different areas in general and valve amps aren't really a viable option unless your overheads are very low.
The Tonemaster series of amps is interesting because it uses a third party SMPS and class D amp module. If that breaks (which it will) then you can just replace that module yourself, no harder than swapping out a graphics card in a PC. But you will be replacing a £150 module because a 12 pence MPCC has shorted ... which is kind of annoying to me but better than writing the whole amp off. The units are also badly fused too, replacing the main or aux PSU fuse is SM work so not something you will do at a gig.
The extra value you’re getting with the valve amp is the present value of a 10 year old valve amp in 10 years time.
You’d need to make some assumptions and do some calculations to try to estimate what that would be, but it would be a pretty small number.
The other big thing for me if I were choosing between a Tonemaster Deluxe and a 68 Custom Deluxe would be how it reacts to rolling back the volume control, particularly when it's being overdriven.
Modelling has got much better at this in the last decade but to my ears it still hasn't cracked it. It sounds good enough for live use, but in terms of enjoying playing an amp in the room and feeling like the guitar and amp are really interacting with each other it's just not there yet
If my TMDR lasts me 10 years and then heads to the tip (well ignore that it's a properly made pine cabinet in classic Fender livery for now I guess) I think that's pretty good value. Mainly because I play the thing, without any compromises, way more than any individual amp I've ever owned.
As others have said, sounds great in its own right and close to that classic Fender tone, DI out and attenuator are as great for gigs as they are for home practice and recording. It's so light I can carry my entire rig up 2 flights without hassle and unload at a gig in one trip, and it looks like a proper Fender rather than some space age tech fest.
If the <5% subjective tonal 'improvement' for a valve amp is worth it for 2-3 times the cost, oncosts like valves and servicing, rattles and buzzes and random issues you have to try and ignore or hope aren't a big deal coz you don't have £200 to take it to a tech this month, then great! Go nuts! I won't do it again.
They're half the price of the valve ones, half the weight of the valve ones and at least twice the usability. Bloody bargain imo
…plus they all seem pretty robust and presumably reasonably repairable. I wouldn’t expect any of them to become landfill anytime soon.