Should she go?

fretmeister

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/orange-order-portadown-northern-ireland-dup-use-banned-drumcree-march-negotiations-with-theresa-may-a7785026.html

Fuck me.

Sinn Fein are going to go mental.

The will be the Bad Friday Agreement.

thomasw88

Modulus_Amps said:

she should go once Sturgeon goes..... another leader that won but really lost

Can't agree with that me old mucker. The SNP were bound to lose a bunch of seats this year.

 They've been in power for 10 years, and from having 56/59 seats they could only go down.
 Sturgeon read the signs wrong fo sure, but the scottish tory party only campaigned as stopping the indyref2.   SNP still the biggest party, and if Brexit is a sh*t storm then reckon SNP will bounce back again.

 They were talking about getting as many as 20 tory seats in scotland,   but with Labour somehow getting back on the map in Scotland (despite kesdale), I reckon the swing will go back to Labour for a few of those  Tory Scottish seats next election.

Fretwired

holnrew said:

Fretwired said:

marantz1300 said:

students have as much right to vote as anyone else

Of course they do .. I'm not talking about taking the vote from them, but they can get a vote where they live (postal vote) which is usually their parents house. A sound point was made on R4 from a constituent who rated Clegg. Poor old Clegg was dumped because the students wanted revenge - the result didn't reflect what most people who live in the town wanted. The students only study there for half the year and then bugger off - he said it's not fair. You elect an MP not a PM.

Many students stay year round, and all students put a lot into the local economy. I think it's fair they get a vote. Clegg went ahead with increasing tuition fees while he knew Sheffield is a university city. As he said, you live by the sword, you die by the sword.

What? I basically live in a Uni town. They've all buggered off .. the  town centre coffee shops are empty.

holnrew

thomasw88 said:

personally I think its an opportunity for the politicans in this country to grow up and try and do some cross party consensus and try and steer a better path through the complete disaster that will be brexit.

Corbyn would be up for it I reckon. 

That would be best for everyone,  but politicians only care about what's best for themselves.

JezWynd

Fretwired said:

She wanted to resign last Friday but was talked out of it. The more leaks that happen the more it looks like she was stitched up. IDS won't come out of this well. She hated the slogans and the focus on her but apparently the Tories were at each others throats and the advisors were bullying everyone. I give this less than a month - the Tory Party will implode.

I wasn't aware of the infighting (but strangely unsurprised) but that doesn't reflect well on her - she should have been in control, not driven by advisors and others, especially as it was her name they were plastering all over the place.

What a colossal fuck up. Truth is Cameron should have triggered the exit process as soon as the referendum was over. The impetus would have been with us and we'd be well on the way to completion by now, instead we're stalled in the driveway.

A coalition of Labour and Conservatives is the only sensible way forward now.

octatonic

John Oliver described her a 'Thatcher in the Rye'.
Genius.

octatonic

I don't think she should go.
I'm sick of political leaders fucking things up and then sodding off.
Stay and fix it.

Modulus_Amps

thomasw88 said:

Modulus_Amps said:

she should go once Sturgeon goes..... another leader that won but really lost

Can't agree with that me old mucker. The SNP were bound to lose a bunch of seats this year.

 They've been in power for 10 years, and from having 56/59 seats they could only go down.
 Sturgeon read the signs wrong fo sure, but the scottish tory party only campaigned as stopping the indyref2.   SNP still the biggest party, and if Brexit is a sh*t storm then reckon SNP will bounce back again.

 They were talking about getting as many as 20 tory seats in scotland,   but with Labour somehow getting back on the map in Scotland (despite kesdale), I reckon the swing will go back to Labour for a few of those  Tory Scottish seats next election.

Ha ha I am clearly not a SNP sympathizer, they would not have lost as many seats if Sturgeons leadership had been better, or perception of her leadership

Philly_Q

It depends whether or not we believe there's any possibility of actually getting a "good" or "bad" Brexit deal. 

Personally I think the "no deal is better than a bad deal" statement was an early admission that they expect to piss about for two years and there'll be no deal at the end of it.

But if there's any chance that the negotiations might actually be worthwhile, so we really want someone in charge who's already demonstrated she has terrible judgement and zero debating skills?

But I don't see any able replacements waiting in the wings.  @Bridgehouse is right, this is more important than party politics and ministers worrying about their own fleeting careers.

bingefeller

I don't care m8.

Bridgehouse

I see more and more people saying "Why don't our politicians stop being self centred egotists and do the right bloody thing and put their heads together - form a big coalition and go do a really good Brexit deal?"

And I see some advantages:

- If May suggests it, it would be the most Strong and Stable thing she had done since she managed to stay upright in a wheat field
- Corbyn would have a chance to demonstrate whether he is a conviction politician or a secret career politician - he could finally piss or get off the pot
- The Public can breathe a sigh of relief and get on with sensible things like watching cricket, drinking beer, moaning about the football, knitting, eating in gastro pubs or whatever the fuck they like rather than getting annoyed about politics
- The markets will stabilise as they see some actual fucking certainty for a change

and here's the biggie:

- Europe will probably go "ooo, didn't see that one coming. Um, interesting. Might need to get our proper compromise negotiating hats on"

I see it here. I see it on Facebook. I see it on Twitter. I hear it on the radio.


We are the electorate. It's our fucking country. 


Will anyone bother to listen to a relatively sensible suggestion?

I bloody doubt it.

ICBM

Theresa May: The prisoner of No 10

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2017-40245800

Sounds about right.

scrumhalf

Has anyone else noticed that her hair is getting progressively shorter?

If she stays on for another couple of months we'll have a skinhead PM.

EricTheWeary

She had some notable failures as Home Secretary, failed as a Remain campaigner, her decision to call a general election was a bad idea from almost any perspective, getting into bed with the DUP looks like to be a disaster waiting to happen and any new government bill is a handful of refuseniks ( or a few by-elections further down the line) from failing. 
However, I can't see that her resignation is of much benefit either, giving us no PM or meaningful government as Brexit negotiations start. If May and other senior politicians could act like grown ups she could run a minority government with cross party working on Brexit and terrorism with the promise of a step down/ further election once Brexit negotiations are complete. Although I'm sure she'd rather screw us all over in the name of party politics. 

Bridgehouse

ICBM said:

Theresa May: The prisoner of No 10

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2017-40245800

Sounds about right.

She needs to pick the phone up and ring Jeremy. 

Tell him to don his best leather arm-patched geography jacket and get his arse over to Number 10. Properly. Walk in the front door with his cheesy beardy smile on his face.

She needs to get the kettle on, make a nice cuppa for them both and then sit down for a good long chat about how the two of them can do their fucking jobs together - how they can work out a strategy to both present a united parliamentary front so that our voted-in appointed representatives can turn up in Brussels next week with a decent folder of A4 paper with some sensible suggestions on it. 

Maybe, just maybe, if this happened, we might not end up looking like the biggest genetically engineered bunch of chuckle brothers and it's a knockout contestants on the face of the planet.

richardhomer

Does anyone really think Brexit will truly be a 'negotiation'?

I'd imagine that the broad brush-strokes have already been decided by the EU - there will be a 'known' level of risk to their businesses - and a known level of copy-cat exits, if the deal looks too good for Britain. Those two issues will set the parameters they are prepared to work within.

I'd be amazed if those in government here don't already have a pretty good idea of what is likely to be possible - assuming either 'no free-movement' or 'free-movement' stance were to be tabled.

It strikes me more of a choice between the two, rather than a nuanced negotiation.

Flink_Poyd

She'll definitely go. I heard she's had an offer from Big Brother and Love Island 

Bridgehouse

richardhomer said:

Does anyone really think Brexit will truly be a 'negotiation'?

I'd imagine that the broad brush-strokes have already been decided by the EU - there will be a 'known' level of risk to their businesses - and a known level of copy-cat exits, if the deal looks too good for Britain. Those two issues will set the parameters they are prepared to work within.

I'd be amazed if those in government here don't already have a pretty good idea of what is likely to be possible - assuming either 'no free-movement' or 'free-movement' stance were to be tabled.

It strikes me more of a choice between the two, rather than a nuanced negotiation.

It entirely depends on the points we put forward to the EU.

It depends on how well our government and civil service works together with parliament to construct a set of arguments as to what the terms should be. How we articulate those points. What we concede on and what we stay firm on. How we set our stall out and how we agree with the EU. It will depend on the basic fact that in any negotiation, both sides adopt a start position and as points get raised or agreed, compromises will be reached. Sometimes things can come out of the blue and change a negotiation completely.

I honestly don't think the EU can afford to have a bad Brexit - I understand the points raised over other states and using us as an 'example', but a hard Brexit could have a significant impact on the EU. A financially unstable UK which crashes will inexorably lead the EU into recession. Similarly, the elements where we provide a tactical support to our european partners - defence, security, anti-terrorism etc. are important to them. I know that they aren't part of the actual EU deal, but they will still be in the back of their minds. 

If we articulate this well, we could do a lot better. 



As it stands at the moment, we are fucked. We might as well send Piers Morgan in to take them out for dinner in the vain hope they will find him charming.

bingefeller

Heartfeltdawn

Fretwired said:

Of course they do .. I'm not talking about taking the vote from them, but they can get a vote where they live (postal vote) which is usually their parents house. A sound point was made on R4 from a constituent who rated Clegg. Poor old Clegg was dumped because the students wanted revenge - the result didn't reflect what most people who live in the town wanted. The students only study there for half the year and then bugger off - he said it's not fair. You elect an MP not a PM.

I don't know if things have changed but my time at university saw me paying 10 months worth of rent from September to the end of June. Certainly not resident for just half the year. After living in Bath and Bristol, both twin university cities, it would be daft to ignore the economic contribution made by students (as well as the negative impact in terms of rental prices on the non-student population). 

Also, we have a large number of MPs with second homes who will almost certainly be even less resident in their current electoral wards than students. Where would you want them to vote? 

Very much right at the infighting in the Conservative party.