Northampton Jam Session - Sunday 3rd December - 1 to 5pm

Bridgehouse

My opinion, FWIW - do the formal half hour three song sessions, then in the next informal half hour everyone gets a chance to kick them around, jam around them, ask "how did you do THAT??" Etc....?

spark240

Maybe a platform to demo your latest solo effort, or competition entry ?

darthed1981

I think the key thing is probably the aims of the day and who participates in what.  The Leicester jam was very much aimed at us less experienced players, and a lot of experienced gigging musicians suffered through some painful experiences to help out us ten-thumbed noise polluters... it was a great day, much learned by all and good times had.

There is totally no obligation whatsoever in any way for every event organised through the forum to work this way.  If someone sets one up and says "no beginners, it's shred challenge day", that is totally their prerogative.

Now, the Northampton one could go either way as it stands, and my point "I'm not adding much value", frankly, in a jam aimed more towards those with decent live experience, I won't.  I'd be better dropping out and watching the videos when you are all done, leaving a place for someone who can help not hinder your performances.  You guys have a right to take these things seriously, and I'm a total amateur!

This HAS to be an option for said musicians as this is not just a beginners board.  Sometimes you "pros" will want to play without someone standing at the back screwing it up for you, and that is totally fine by me.

Playing the songs multiple times doesn't necessarily help, as you would end up having a "good" version and a "bad" version for, Live Forever, for example, which sucks for the noticeably worse version and won't help anyone's confidence.

@mrkb set it all up, so Mark what's your perception of the day?

I'm honestly not being funny or flouncy at all, as I know for certain that no-one going would dream of discouraging a less experienced player, but if really some "pros" want to get together and play properly, then that is a different thing to an event more aimed at teaching and participating like Leicester was.

Thoughts?  Clarification here could help me and possibly a few others.

impmann

Actually - I genuinely GENUINELY believe it is good for everyone to play with people of every ability. Yes, it can be a challenge backing someone who's struggling - but I have complete respect for that individual and am not judgemental.

TBH, some pub jams can degenerate into dick measuring competitions if everyone is at "a certain level" and there are some who genuinely enjoy belittling others to make themselves look better than they are. Frankly these people are cunts and I have no time for them.

So I'd hate to see a seperation of skill levels - and if something falls apart when you are playing it, just smile, laugh and learn from it.

Bridgehouse

Totally agree @impmann.

As a bass player I play a lot less notes. Does that make me crap? And believe me, it's easy for a bass line to fall apart no matter how hard you practise

LuttiS

Not going to this jam, but still having a following thread

Playing with a more experienced person imo is the fastest was to improve guitar and it can be rewarding on both sides - the learning and the teaching. 

and as @impmann said i'd hate to see separation too, i imagine for most of us here this is a hobby, and it's all about spreading the love and having a laugh when things fudge up

aord43

I am also a beginner at live/playing with others.  But I got the impression that several attendees are in a similar boat, or at least we were able to play together in Leicester  @mrkb, @TADodger ).  

darthed1981

Thanks all - just clarifying really, we need to know everyone is going on the same page.  Some songs (like Comfy) might be more "exhibition" numbers and others we might even say, "if it all goes tits up we will actually stop, dispense tips and advice, and start again"...

I was even tempted to say "screw it, I'll try Plug In Baby again" - sitting down this time, but I don't want to ruin anyones day!

impmann

darthed1981 said:

Thanks all - just clarifying really, we need to know everyone is going on the same page.  Some songs (like Comfy) might be more "exhibition" numbers and others we might even say, "if it all goes tits up we will actually stop, dispense tips and advice, and start again"...

I was even tempted to say "screw it, I'll try Plug In Baby again" - sitting down this time, but I don't want to ruin anyones day!

TADodger

I agree with the principle that mixing with players of different abilitys / styles is a big plus to improving, but nicking @Bridgehouse point, I can't help feeling that the opportunity to 'kick them around, jam around them, ask "how did you do THAT??" Etc....?' is the bit that helps with improvement. 

For example, at home I can pretty much nail the intro to Fortunate Son 80% of the time, but at the Jam, no way could I get close. It would have been good to get some thoughts on why and tips for next time to try.

Like @darthed1981, I recognise that not all jams will be suitable and completely get that, (although i might still want to turn up and listen to see what I can pick up). 

TTony

TADodger said:

For example, at home I can pretty much nail the intro to Fortunate Son 80% of the time, but at the Jam, no way could I get close. 

That's the same experience that most of us have been through @TADodger. ; Playing the simplest track at home is very different to playing with others.

Unfortunately, the only tip that I've ever found to work is "play with others more often".  It's as simple - or as difficult - as that!

And that's why these jam sessions are so good for people making that leap.  There are others around with the experience of having made that leap, remember what it's like, and are quite happy to play through the intro "X" times until you nail it.

When you've done it once, you'll do it most every time.

Flink_Poyd

Since I've said I'm going to have a go at singing there seems to be a few trying to back out. 
Any connection?

mrkb

I intended this jam to be a mix of stuff I enjoyed from the Leicester event. Playing a few songs as cover versions meant I put some effort into learning a whole song (intro and all) and playing it with others who also knew that song , and I also really enjoyed the ‘play some chords and let people try inventing rhythms and soloing over it’ but this was limited as none of us knew the same chord sequences- hence I felt that room could have run better if we all had an understanding of the same chords- so I’d like to select some jam chord sequences as well so people come prepared.

There isn’t a slick backing band at this one - looks like I’ll be playing drums and I’ve only been playing them 2.5 years. So it will mean I make mistakes, but that’s how I’ll learn and progress- If we want/need to run through a song again to help us learn we will do so. it will have the same encouraging atmosphere as the Leicester one. All abilities are welcome as long as they want to join in and are supportive of others.

im on holiday at the moment - can discuss this more at the weekend if needed.

mrkb

@tadodger - I almost know the full Fortunate Son drum parts - would be happy a version of that with you. 

Bridgehouse

Playing live with others is a confidence thing. If you can nail it at home then you can play it. If you can't do it when live with others it's all about confidence.

Playing something is a skill you learn. Playing something live is a different one - it's again all about practise

mrkb

Oh, and my definition of ‘Pro’ is anyone who’s played one song in public in the last 10 years. We need a few of those to help us sound coherent!

TADodger

TTony said:

TADodger said:

For example, at home I can pretty much nail the intro to Fortunate Son 80% of the time, but at the Jam, no way could I get close. 

That's the same experience that most of us have been through @TADodger. ; Playing the simplest track at home is very different to playing with others.

Unfortunately, the only tip that I've ever found to work is "play with others more often".  It's as simple - or as difficult - as that!

And that's why these jam sessions are so good for people making that leap.  There are others around with the experience of having made that leap, remember what it's like, and are quite happy to play through the intro "X" times until you nail it.

When you've done it once, you'll do it most every time.

thanks @TTony -  I think it is the playing it as part of fitting into an actual song timing (and the standing up, which could also benefit from some tips I'm sure!). I guess what I am saying is having the more experienced players with time to be able to offer advise and the chance to run-through some of those 'tougher' bits is valuable.

@mrkb - happy to try it again if you are not fully occupied

Plectrum

TADodger said:

For example, at home I can pretty much nail the intro to Fortunate Son 80% of the time, but at the Jam, no way could I get close. It would have been good to get some thoughts on why and tips for next time to try.

Simple. You haven't practised it enough. If you can't play a piece right every single time at home then you're not going to magically improve when you, possibly nervously, play it in front of others.

Bridgehouse

Plectrum said:

TADodger said:

For example, at home I can pretty much nail the intro to Fortunate Son 80% of the time, but at the Jam, no way could I get close. It would have been good to get some thoughts on why and tips for next time to try.

Simple. You haven't practised it enough. If you can't play a piece right every single time at home then you're not going to magically improve when you, possibly nervously, play it in front of others.

Actually your hit rate will go down (a lot) 

TTony

Plectrum said:

TADodger said:

For example, at home I can pretty much nail the intro to Fortunate Son 80% of the time, but at the Jam, no way could I get close. It would have been good to get some thoughts on why and tips for next time to try.

Simple. You haven't practised it enough. If you can't play a piece right every single time at home then you're not going to magically improve when you, possibly nervously, play it in front of others.

I agree in part @plectrum, but not fully.

There are plenty of excellent, note perfect, bedroom players around.  But when they get up to play in a group, they find that it all goes horribly wrong.

Or maybe someone else in the band does something different or unexpected, and the play-alone-perfect can't deal with anything un-practised.  

Sure, you need a basic level of competence before getting on a stage, but you'll learn different playing skills on the stage compared to what you'd learn in a bedroom.