Help me to escape the bloody blues scale!!!!!!

roberty

Connecting pentatonics horizontally

https://youtu.be/RCPRqZFjML0

You can do a lot with pentatonics tbf and fill it in with colour tones here and there

roberty

Blues outside the box

https://youtu.be/00pQ4yFn0Bw

PeteC

Bit late  - but speaking as someone who went through the same frustrations in my early 50s (good rock player but stuck in pentatonic soloing) my advice would be to spend time learning the major, minor, augmented and diminished triads on the different sets of three strings, and then learn their positions up and down the neck.   Guthrie Trapp, Tom Bukovac and Tomo Fujita are all big proponents of this.   Once you have knowledge of the triads your lead playing will open up quickly and youll probably be surprised how well you can move around the neck when youre improvising over stuff.  Tomo has some good stuff on YT on this, as does Guthrie Trapp. 

Just knowing that a chord progression moves from say Gmajor to Eminor 7 means you already have tons of single line options using your triads.  Later you can start adding chromatics amd other scale tones around your triads.  Daniel Weiss has some fabulous videos on YT showing how to do this.   

Good luck and have fun with it. 

viz

Another thing to do, is think about the notes that are absent from the penta scale, and start using them, accentuating them even. 

So, say you’re in a minor key, for example, A minor. 

Like any minor penta, you have the 1, m3, 4, 5, m7 and 8. In A minor, that’s A, C, D, E, G, A. 

But the 2 and the 6 are absent from this pentatonic scale. These two notes are crucial for adding colour to the base-palette that is pentatonic. 

The 2 (or 9) can be used to provide questioning, or mysterious flavours; the 6 can be used to provide tragic or uplifting flavours (amongst other flavours too of course, but this is a good start)

So as an example, try adding a 2 or 9 to your penta noodling, not a b9 for the time being, but a normal 9 - a B in other words. And hone in on that note while you noodle. Give it a bit of length, a bit of accentuation. Slide up to it from the A a couple of times. Try using it instead of the m3. Try using it instead of the 1. Give it some space. Taste it. In time you’ll sound a bit jazzy. 

Or remove the 9 and add a 6. Try adding a major 6th first, an F#. Again, try and hone in on it as you noodle past it. Try playing it without the 7th. By switching the sad m7 for an upbeat 6, you are lifting the mood significantly. 

(You can get these notes by playing the fret marker notes on the A string, by the way: A C D E F# A.)

Now try a flattened 6th instead, and put the 7th back in. Now you have a more tragic scale than penta which is a bit bland. That flattened (minor) 6th imparts the most sorrow into any minor piece. A C D E F G A. 

Or you could try using a b2 (or b9). You can do it with or without the b6. This starts to make the music dark and mysterious. A Bb C D E (F) G A. 

You can even do a b9 with a normal 6. This is slightly unusual but it has a lovely unique sound, once you get familiar with it. It’s a mode of melodic minor, incidently. And by the way, by doing these things above, you are inadvertantly experimenting with the diatonic modes - Dorian, Aeolian and Phrygian. 

Fun times. 

axisus

The last two posts go way too technical for a duffer like me! I appreciate them of course, but I could never consider that level of theory without an actual teacher, something that I don't have time or money for at present. 

viz

axisus said:

The last two posts go way too technical for a duffer like me! I appreciate them of course, but I could never consider that level of theory without an actual teacher, something that I don't have time or money for at present. 

Fair enough. Ok, for adding the 2 (or 9) in the example above, you can cheat:

Over an A minor chord, Instead of playing Am penta around fret 5 like you normally do, move your whole hand up to fret 12 (or down to the nut), and play Em penta. That effectively adds the 2, at the expense of the 3.

(Remember that the root of the scale is still the A (fret 2 or 14 on the G string and the open A string (or fret 12 on the A))). 

Or if you want to add a 6, still over an Am backing chord, move your whole hand up two frets from the Am position to fret 7, and play Bm penta. That adds the 6 (it also adds the 2), and it removes the 3 and the 7. 

(Remember again that the root of the scale is still A. Fret 10 on the B string and fret 7 on the D string). 

Both those hacks let you learn the flavours of the 2 and the 6 within an Am context. Once you are totally familiar with the new sounds (after a week or two), try going back to fret 5, reading my earlier post, and introducing those new sounds into your traditional Am penta fingering. 

axisus

viz said:

axisus said:

The last two posts go way too technical for a duffer like me! I appreciate them of course, but I could never consider that level of theory without an actual teacher, something that I don't have time or money for at present. 

Fair enough. Ok, for adding the 2 (or 9) in the example above, you can cheat:

Over an A minor chord, Instead of playing Am penta around fret 5 like you normally do, move your whole hand up to fret 12 (or down to the nut), and play Em penta. That effectively adds the 2, at the expense of the 3.

Or if you want to add a 6, still over an Am backing chord, move your whole hand up two frets from the Am position to fret 7, and play Bm penta. That adds the 6 (it also adds the 2), and it removes the 3 and the 7. 

Both those hacks let you learn the flavours of the 2 and the 6 within an Am context. Once you are totally familiar with the new sounds (after a week or two), try going back to fret 5, reading my earlier post, and introducing those new sounds into your traditional Am penta fingering. 

I'll give it a try!

Gizmo

Not sure if this (or it's like) has been posted....but drop the 4th & 5th from your MBS and you'll have a minor 7b5 Arpeggio to shred with,Quite Greg howe'ish...a good break down here

Or drop the 4th and Minor 7 from a natural minor/Aeolian scale and get the Hirajoshi Scale

Rio

I'm probably commenting as one who should not, but I have two suggestions.

1) Stay pentatonic for now and concentrate on a "call and response" feel to your playing. The aimless noodling drops away, and now the music is having a conversation with itself.

2) Noodle, but as you do, throw in a real stinker of a note that "doesn't fit", then try to feel where that note wants to go. Fight your way back to the pentatonic.

Rio

LionAquaLooper

The problem isn't necessarily the scale you use. End of the day the blues scale is just a pentatonic with a flat fifth. That's 6 notes. Most western scales have 7 (8 if you count the octave root note). If you're playing in key and using a pentatonic, fundamentally speaking you're already playing 5 notes out of those 7. There's really not much more you can do  than add the 2 additional notes of the scale if the backing chords are straightforward. I find it's more important to know how to use the notes on that scale and when. Play a pentatonic against a 1-4-5 progression and you'll sound bluesy. Play the same pentatonic against a jazzier progression in the same key and you'll sound jazzier (as long as  you play to the rhythm).