The F1 thread

chillidoggy

Mateschitz has given Red Bull until November 21/22 to find an engine. Still reckon it'll be Renault.

stickyfiddle

Thejudge reporting RB have formally issued notice to cancel the Renault contract. 

Entirely possible they'll be signing another contract tomorrow for rebranded "Infiniti" engines or whatever next week. 

Fuck knows at this point. 

Ron Dennis needs firing, at least from the F1 side of the company.

chillidoggy

On Eurosport I read that Renault hasn't yet confirmed the split from Red Bull. 

Fretwired

chillidoggy said:

Mateschitz has given Red Bull until November 21/22 to find an engine. Still reckon it'll be Renault.

Renault have said they will not decide until the end of December whilst they try and take over Lotus. If the Lotus deal goes through Renault have said they will not supply Red Bull. The only option is Honda.

chillidoggy

But given their contractual arrangements, Honda isn't an option, according to Big Ron, and Boullier. I wonder if there's going to be some money changing hands to remove their contractual obligation?

Fretwired

chillidoggy said:

But given their contractual arrangements, Honda isn't an option, according to Big Ron, and Boullier. I wonder if there's going to be some money changing hands to remove their contractual obligation?

According to Bernie it would be for two years so there's speculation VAG may enter F1. So the thinking is Ron gets cash to help rebuild the team and help from RB to get the Honda engine working so he can get some sponsors. The fear for Ron is Honda walk away as McLaren have been critical of Honda in the same way RB have about Renault.

hungrymark

VAG, hurr hur hurrrr

chillidoggy

Fretwired said:

chillidoggy said:

But given their contractual arrangements, Honda isn't an option, according to Big Ron, and Boullier. I wonder if there's going to be some money changing hands to remove their contractual obligation?

According to Bernie it would be for two years so there's speculation VAG may enter F1. So the thinking is Ron gets cash to help rebuild the team and help from RB to get the Honda engine working so he can get some sponsors. The fear for Ron is Honda walk away as McLaren have been critical of Honda in the same way RB have about Renault.

I can't see Honda walking away, but I can see Red Bull if they don't get what they want.

If there's a deal to be had, I reckon it will involve cash going into McLaren's coffers as a sop. As for VAG, I guess that's all down to money, but I read somewhere it could be done using the Audi brand name.

It just goes to show the insidious nature of the dwarf, and how he's got a finger in everyone's pie.

Fretwired

chillidoggy said:

Fretwired said:

chillidoggy said:

But given their contractual arrangements, Honda isn't an option, according to Big Ron, and Boullier. I wonder if there's going to be some money changing hands to remove their contractual obligation?

According to Bernie it would be for two years so there's speculation VAG may enter F1. So the thinking is Ron gets cash to help rebuild the team and help from RB to get the Honda engine working so he can get some sponsors. The fear for Ron is Honda walk away as McLaren have been critical of Honda in the same way RB have about Renault.

I can't see Honda walking away, but I can see Red Bull if they don't get what they want.

If there's a deal to be had, I reckon it will involve cash going into McLaren's coffers as a sop. As for VAG, I guess that's all down to money, but I read somewhere it could be done using the Audi brand name.

It just goes to show the insidious nature of the dwarf, and how he's got a finger in everyone's pie.

Apparently VAG are keen as a way of improving their image worldwide. They'll need a few years to develop an engine so I guess that's all Red Bull would need. As you say there's a deal to be done.

Heartfeltdawn

Fretwired said:Apparently VAG are keen as a way of improving their image worldwide. They'll need a few years to develop an engine so I guess that's all Red Bull would need. As you say there's a deal to be done.

And what better way to rebuild your caring sharing squeaky clean image than by getting involved in a sport that welcomes Putin's money, will bend over backwards for the bullshit state of Azerbaijan, is dominated by a dwarf who paid his way out of prison in Germany, is part owned by a filthy greedy company in CVC, has a falling spectator market and television ratings, and is facing an investigation by the EU into how it is run

Fretwired

Heartfeltdawn said:

Fretwired said:Apparently VAG are keen as a way of improving their image worldwide. They'll need a few years to develop an engine so I guess that's all Red Bull would need. As you say there's a deal to be done.

And what better way to rebuild your caring sharing squeaky clean image than by getting involved in a sport that welcomes Putin's money, will bend over backwards for the bullshit state of Azerbaijan, is dominated by a dwarf who paid his way out of prison in Germany, is part owned by a filthy greedy company in CVC, has a falling spectator market and television ratings, and is facing an investigation by the EU into how it is run

Exactly .. :-)

VAG will be welcomed with open arms so long as their wallet is wide open.

Heartfeltdawn

Fretwired said:

Exactly .. :-)

VAG will be welcomed with open arms so long as their wallet is wide open.

If I had Photoshop skills, I'd put Bernie in the front seat. 

http://www.historytoday.com/sites/default/files/articles/vw.jpg

stickyfiddle

Apparently RB have been modding the Renault engine in their mysterious "Building 9", to be used next year branded as Infiniti, presumably still paying Nissan/Renault a hefty sum. If true it would be a huge step...  

http://thejudge13.com/2015/11/05/exclusive-red-bull-secure-an-engine-for-2016/

Fretwired

stickyfiddle said:

Apparently RB have been modding the Renault engine in their mysterious "Building 9", to be used next year branded as Infiniti, presumably still paying Nissan/Renault a hefty sum. If true it would be a huge step...  

http://thejudge13.com/2015/11/05/exclusive-red-bull-secure-an-engine-for-2016/

Wow .. never saw that coming .. Mercedes should start worrying.

stickyfiddle

Fretwired said:

stickyfiddle said:

Apparently RB have been modding the Renault engine in their mysterious "Building 9", to be used next year branded as Infiniti, presumably still paying Nissan/Renault a hefty sum. If true it would be a huge step...  

http://thejudge13.com/2015/11/05/exclusive-red-bull-secure-an-engine-for-2016/

Wow .. never saw that coming .. Mercedes should start worrying.

Yup. I knew about Building 9 and assumed they were doing something with their own engine entirely, but with all the shit they've been spouting assumed they weren't even close to happy with it yet.

chillidoggy

You need to listen to your old uncle Chilli - I told you it would be Renault!

......ish.

Fretwired

stickyfiddle said:

Fretwired said:

stickyfiddle said:

Apparently RB have been modding the Renault engine in their mysterious "Building 9", to be used next year branded as Infiniti, presumably still paying Nissan/Renault a hefty sum. If true it would be a huge step...  

http://thejudge13.com/2015/11/05/exclusive-red-bull-secure-an-engine-for-2016/

Wow .. never saw that coming .. Mercedes should start worrying.

Yup. I knew about Building 9 and assumed they were doing something with their own engine entirely, but with all the shit they've been spouting assumed they weren't even close to happy with it yet.

I knew Red Bull wanted to build their own engine but Horner had said the cost was going to be too high so he project was scrapped. Never thought they'd be able to do a deal with Renault like this but I guess it's win/win. Renault get some tech to improve their engine and some cash without having RB slagging them off on race day and can be competitive with their new works team.

Unless Renault now quit F1.

fretmeister

Fretwired said:

stickyfiddle said:

Apparently RB have been modding the Renault engine in their mysterious "Building 9", to be used next year branded as Infiniti, presumably still paying Nissan/Renault a hefty sum. If true it would be a huge step...  

http://thejudge13.com/2015/11/05/exclusive-red-bull-secure-an-engine-for-2016/

Wow .. never saw that coming .. Mercedes should start worrying.

Yeah.

In about 2018.

Heartfeltdawn

stickyfiddle said:

Apparently RB have been modding the Renault engine in their mysterious "Building 9", to be used next year branded as Infiniti, presumably still paying Nissan/Renault a hefty sum. If true it would be a huge step...  

http://thejudge13.com/2015/11/05/exclusive-red-bull-secure-an-engine-for-2016/

The article says "TJ13 has been informed that Red Bull Racing are already confident they will start the 2016 season with a revised version of the current Renault 12 token upgraded ICE, with a power unit producing in excess of a 40 BHP advantage."

Yasuhisa Aria said about the time of the Belgium Grand Prix that Honda were 25 bhp ahead of Renault and 50 bhp behind Mercedes, meaning Renault are some 75bph short of the Mercedes power unit. If the TJ13 article is correct, the 2016 Red Bull power unit will produce in excess of 40bhp more than the current power unit. In other words, the 2016 power unit would still be some 30bhp short of the 2015 Mercedes power unit. 

But what about the fuel? One of the fascinating things this year has been the chemicals the teams use. 

http://www.skysports.com/f1/news/32420/9983506/fuelling-f1s-battle-for-engine-supremacy-in-2015

Fretwired

Heartfeltdawn said:

stickyfiddle said:

Apparently RB have been modding the Renault engine in their mysterious "Building 9", to be used next year branded as Infiniti, presumably still paying Nissan/Renault a hefty sum. If true it would be a huge step...  

http://thejudge13.com/2015/11/05/exclusive-red-bull-secure-an-engine-for-2016/

The article says "TJ13 has been informed that Red Bull Racing are already confident they will start the 2016 season with a revised version of the current Renault 12 token upgraded ICE, with a power unit producing in excess of a 40 BHP advantage."

Yasuhisa Aria said about the time of the Belgium Grand Prix that Honda were 25 bhp ahead of Renault and 50 bhp behind Mercedes, meaning Renault are some 75bph short of the Mercedes power unit. If the TJ13 article is correct, the 2016 Red Bull power unit will produce in excess of 40bhp more than the current power unit. In other words, the 2016 power unit would still be some 30bhp short of the 2015 Mercedes power unit. 

But what about the fuel? One of the fascinating things this year has been the chemicals the teams use. 

http://www.skysports.com/f1/news/32420/9983506/fuelling-f1s-battle-for-engine-supremacy-in-2015

Unfortunately Yasuhisa Aria has made bold claims all season that have proven to be false.