Post COVID, pressure on primary breadwinners

Jetsam1

Rob1742 said:

It’s very bad for peoples development. Interaction in the office is key and new starters can’t bounce off colleagues day to day like they used to. So individuals progress is being hampered without question. 

The other point is we spend all our time arranging meetings where suppliers can only do 11.00am as they have to take their kids to school first or pick them up. 

It will work for a percentage of people individually, but it’s not helping business and not helping new people who come into a business develop.a

That's not how we do it. You have some flexibility in hours but are expected to be around during an agreed set of hours. My managers are flexible and supportive but as we get the work done all is cool and groovy.

Or is the problem that us little drones and peasants got a little something and now the bosses are crying as it's harder to lord it over us and micro manage their little empires if they can't stand over us physically as a collossus? (Harder to psychologically abuse and bully? Or is that me being cynical about the "Business World"?). Somebodies real estate investments losing a few percent?

Not traipsing into a city is great. But if there was some effort making offices nicer places to be that might help. Working transport systems so getting there is not an expensive nightmare as well (this would help everyone equally so can't have that). I was in on Wednesday and whilst it is not too bad a place as far as these things go and located on a business estate so by car is easy I struggled to concentrate and found it uncomfortable.

I used to be in IT and am good at communicating remotely so not an issue. Never found not being face to face with someone to exchange information or learn a new thing to be an issue either. If suppliers are not available in agreed contact times then that is not WFH fault as a system, that is a failure of their personal work systems. Who drops kids off at 11am?

Sporky

Rob1742 said:

The other point is we spend all our time arranging meetings where suppliers can only do 11.00am as they have to take their kids to school first or pick them up. 

I don't think this is true either - it's too sweeping a generalisation to hold firm.

Do we all spend all our time arranging meetings? That sounds silly. There'd be no time left to have the meetings. I don't think everyone has meetings with suppliers, either, and my experience isn't that every supplier has kids, nor that the ones who do take until 11am every day to get them to school. 

Penn

My office went after Covid. I was given a desk in another building a couple of years ago. I never really went in if I could help it. It’s 3 trains and 3 hours travelling to get there. 

 I went up to my building a few weeks ago with my boss and it was empty. All the people and desks have gone elsewhere. Probably 3/4 of the building is empty and is going to be demolished soon to make way for a new building. 

I don’t miss the office. 2/3 hours a day commuting and the couple of grand season ticket. 

Work from home isn’t perfect but in an imperfect world it’s the best choice for me and I’m glad to do it. 

TTony

Sporky said:

It's weird; it's as if almost everything we talk about here doesn't have a simple, universal, binary answer.  

Exactly.

Some people do work that can be done equally effectively in or out of a specific location.  Others don't.
Some people have personal characteristics or preferences that mean they work more effectively co-located with others.  Others don't.
Some people work for companies (others don't) who prefer their employees to be in an office.  Others don't.


Any blanket statements that attempt to generalise individual perspectives into a one-size-fits-all rule will be wrong.

Including that statement.

chrisj1602

Axe_meister said:

I don't know if anyone else feels the same. But since COVID and a increased ability to work from home, do you find there is more pressure to always work from home, be there for deliveries, kids, etc, whilst your partner is able to their hobbies/Small business, etc.
Whilst it has positives, it does add extra pressure, reduces visibility in the workplace, potentially decreases career prospects.

My wife is a bit of a nightmare for this. My employer is good with flexibility, but ultimately I am supposed to work 40% in the office which she seems to have very little respect for.

Then there’s the “did you do the hoovering?” I do hoover sometimes I might add, but the other day I said “No”

Wife “Why, what did you do on your lunch?”
Me: “Well I made and ate lunch and had a bit of a break” as if that is unreasonable… why do I even need to answer that?!

I’m pretty sure she wasn’t running Henry the hoover around her office on her break.

Also, the deliveries thing. Sometimes I like a lunchtime run… but no, I get a text… my Boohoo is out for delivery. Shoot me.

thecolourbox

I think an important part of this sort of thing though is the self awareness and using your mind to observe and to work out what's good/bad for you, and that includes having conversations with those whom it affects - wives, bosses, whoever really - to discuss your point of view, what you need, and how it will benefit them as well as you as a result. 

Working at home or working in the office isn't the problem, it's how you fit with it according to how you're wired I think. Working at Home doesn't automatically mean you're skiving, or having to hoover, or answer the doors (I don't answer my door, shudder). Working from the office doesn't automatically mean your career will magically progress, you'll have loads of "work friends", or you get free loo roll to use. It's just how you fit into it that's the most important.

Side Note: is it just around here then that delivery people don't need you to answer the door and just leave stuff in the bin or on the doorstep?

Sporky

Jetsam1 said:

But if there was some effort making offices nicer places to be that might help. 

Yes - and that doesn't mean having table football and pizza. Our London office is too bright and too noisy - they put music through the ceiling speakers! I cannot concentrate there, so I cannot do my job. I can use my noise-cancelling headphones, but then I'm just sitting at a desk with a smaller monitor than I have at home.

Fortunately my employer doesn't need me in the office, so they don't try to make me be in the office except when it's genuinely useful. 

Jetsam1

Sporky said:

Jetsam1 said:

But if there was some effort making offices nicer places to be that might help. 

Yes - and that doesn't mean having table football and pizza. Our London office is too bright and too noisy - they put music through the ceiling speakers! I cannot concentrate there, so I cannot do my job. I can use my noise-cancelling headphones, but then I'm just sitting at a desk with a smaller monitor than I have at home.

Fortunately my employer doesn't need me in the office, so they don't try to make me be in the office except when it's genuinely useful. 

Yeah this is my experience and I am surprised at myself for how much I have changed over the last 7 years or so. Don't need gimmicks, just decent lighting, decent chairs and decent desks with appropriate docks and monitors. Simple stuff and yet seems so hard to get right. I prefer my corner by the window in a house in the forest!!!