SP Energy Network Power Cut Killed My Naim Muso QB

SlopeSoarer

On Friday night we had an odd type of power cut, (I've since found out it is called a brown out) and it basically killed my WiFi music streamer a Naim Muso QB.

I've contacted the grid suppliers for our area which are SP Energy Network for advice on compensation, and they've just replied with...

Thank you for your enquiry

 SP Energy Networks although sympathetic to any expense incurred during the fault cannot accept liability for consequential loss or material damage as incidents such as these are out with our control.  Unfortunately, faults can and do occur on our network without SP Energy Networks being aware in advance.  We can’t guarantee a continuous supply.

 We continually strive to reduce the impact of faults on our customers, both in terms of the number of customers affected, and the duration they are without supply.

Please accept our apologies for the inconvenience caused.

Do you think I should accept this response or do you think I should pursue it further? And if yes how?

Definitely hacked off at the minute!

goldtop

Odd that Naim would make a device that can't survive a bornw-out! Being digital, I presume it's borked some part of its memory and lack of imagination meant that they didn't program a graceful recovery. Sucks.

Does Naim offer servicing?

It's not the grid's fault.

SlopeSoarer

Yeah I've contacted Naim today but they they wouldn't be operating Sunday's I guess, so no response. I've seen from an old post on another forum, repair costs of £200 for similar issue.

What makes you say it isn't the grids fault? As I see it part of their equipment failing has resulted in damage to my equipment, regardless of how Naim designed the system.

Kittyfrisk

Sadly, I doubt that you have any comeback against the power supplier.
https://www.ukpowernetworks.co.uk/help-and-contact/compensation-a-power-cut-damaged-something-in-my-home
You aren't alone in having issues or in not having anything to be able to blame the supplier for.
https://www.thefretboard.co.uk/discussion/comment/3720619/#Comment_3720619

SlopeSoarer

Thanks @Kittyfrisk for the info, I'll not wind myself up anymore. Diolch

Kittyfrisk

SlopeSoarer said:

Thanks @Kittyfrisk for the info, I'll not wind myself up anymore. Diolch

Not a lot of help at all I'm afraid.
I had hoped that Diolch was Welsh for 'What a bunch of unnacountable, uncaring cunts affect our lives"...   

goldtop

SlopeSoarer said:

Yeah I've contacted Naim today but they they wouldn't be operating Sunday's I guess, so no response. I've seen from an old post on another forum, repair costs of £200 for similar issue.

What makes you say it isn't the grids fault? As I see it part of their equipment failing has resulted in damage to my equipment, regardless of how Naim designed the system.

Have a look at your supply contract. Sadly, loss of supply to domestic electricity customers is not an uncommon occurrence. But it's a chance we pay for. We really wouldn't want to pay the necessary £££££s for a supply that was guaranteed to have 100% uptime, even if the supplier could offer it.

With more and more digital devices at home, a UPS may be wise for more expensive devices. Unless/until manufacturers design them to cope with power outages (cheap if designed in from the start).

My stereo has old-fashioned digital electronics, so is safe, but it has an HDD, so one day....

SlopeSoarer

goldtop said:

SlopeSoarer said:

Yeah I've contacted Naim today but they they wouldn't be operating Sunday's I guess, so no response. I've seen from an old post on another forum, repair costs of £200 for similar issue.

What makes you say it isn't the grids fault? As I see it part of their equipment failing has resulted in damage to my equipment, regardless of how Naim designed the system.

Have a look at your supply contract. Sadly, loss of supply to domestic electricity customers is not an uncommon occurrence. But it's a chance we pay for. We really wouldn't want to pay the necessary £££££s for a supply that was guaranteed to have 100% uptime, even if the supplier could offer it.

With more and more digital devices at home, a UPS may be wise for more expensive devices. Unless/until manufacturers design them to cope with power outages (cheap if designed in from the start).

My stereo has old-fashioned digital electronics, so is safe, but it has an HDD, so one day....

Cheers @goldtop I get your point though I also agree with @Kittyfrisk's hope for the meaning of Diolch! 

My brother as also pointed me in the direction of UPS's, I need to do something when I get it sorted as power cuts are a bit of feature of the area where I live.

Thanks for the therapeutic contributions.

rlw

Insurance claim ?

ToneControl

I had a brown-out down to 110v to 120v about 15 years ago
IIRC it killed the motherboard in an expensive workstation

I bought a UPS, but it was never useful really. Also it was not powerful enough to drive the central heating, which was another reason I got it, since we had a few overhead line outages there.

Anyway, it stopped working after just a few years.

If you don't need always-on availability for business, I'd say it's probably better and cheaper to get a device that just disconnects the power when it drops below 180v. Does such a thing exist?

drofluf

I’d question how fit for purpose any device was that couldn’t handle a power cut. 

Danny1969

Most modern stuff doesn’t really care too much about the input voltage dropping  as the output voltage needed is far lower than the mains . It’s  created by varying the pulse width of a switching  transistor to keep the output voltage matched to a reference voltage. If the input voltage drops from the mains then the pulse width is increased to counter it.  In this way a laptop charger for example can operate anywhere in the world … from  240 V down to 110 V et cetera

Rotational hard drives are actually generally fine if the powers cut as well because the hard drive has a reaction mechanism that pulls the head away from the platter when it loses power. 

The thing that can cause problems is overvoltage spikes . A well designed switch mode power supply has protection but cheaper ones may not survive an overvoltage spike. 

HerrMetal

Last time we had some electrical work done I had a surge protection device (SPD) added to our consumer unit.  No idea how effective it would be in any given scenario but I think the latest regulations recommend or possibly even require them. It wasn't a significant cost in the wider scope of what was being done.

SlopeSoarer

rlw said:

Insurance claim ?

Submitted

drofluf said:

I’d question how fit for purpose any device was that couldn’t handle a power cut. 

I'll put that question to Naim when they get back to me

HerrMetal said:

Last time we had some electrical work done I had a surge protection device (SPD) added to our consumer unit.  No idea how effective it would be in any given scenario but I think the latest regulations recommend or possibly even require them. It wasn't a significant cost in the wider scope of what was being done.

I've wondered since about surge protection but my more knowledgeable brother seemed to think UPS was the better way but says that the batteries tend to die after a few years and as @ToneControl suggests.

Thanks again for your input.

TTony

SlopeSoarer said:

HerrMetal said:

Last time we had some electrical work done I had a surge protection device (SPD) added to our consumer unit.  No idea how effective it would be in any given scenario but I think the latest regulations recommend or possibly even require them. It wasn't a significant cost in the wider scope of what was being done.

I've wondered since about surge protection but my more knowledgeable brother seemed to think UPS was the better way but says that the batteries tend to die after a few years and as @ToneControl suggests.

Isn't surge protection to guard against a different problem?  It might protect against spikes, but not brown-outs.

Sporky

Yes, but a spike is more likely to cause damage than a brown-out is. There may well have been a spike prior to the dip; the two might even have been related. 

drofluf

drofluf said:

I’d question how fit for purpose any device was that couldn’t handle a power cut. 

Is there any way to establish as to whether you also experienced a power surge? As @Danny1969 says a greater threat is a surge/overvoltage spike? I'm assuming they're the same thing but prepared to be corrected

SlopeSoarer

This was the follow up SP Energy Networks...

I am writing in relation to the supply interruption you experienced on 12th April 2024, our incident reference, INCD-1007251-s. Firstly, may I apologise for any inconvenience caused by the interruption. I have tried to contact you by the telephone number we hold on to our records to discuss this further but have been unsuccessful. I can confirm we became aware of this fault at 20:41 on 12th April 2024. Our recourses attended site to complete the necessary repairs as quickly and safely as possible and it was identified that this interruption was due to a faulted jumper on the high voltage network. Supply was restored to all customers at 00:37 on 13th April 2024. Customer calls are important to us, as they can sometimes be essential when recording times of interruptions. Due to this, our records of power cuts show the interruption time as when we became aware of the loss of power. This is because we are not aware of a loss of power until we receive a customer call. Our faults & emergency team operate 24 hours a day and would recommend you contact them in the first instance of any supply issues. They can advise you if there are any faults on the network and log a call if required. In the event of a supply interruption please contact our 24hr emergency centre on 0800 001 5400 or 0330 101 400 from a mobile or 105. SP Energy Networks, as do all UK Electricity Distributors, do not undertake to provide a constant uninterrupted supply or that the supply will be free of any brief fluctuations. Regardless of how much we protect, maintain our equipment, faults may still occur. There will always be circumstances beyond our control, which can affect the electrical network. Whilst I appreciate the inconvenience caused by this loss of power and I am sorry to hear of the damage to your electricity meter and HiFi equipment, in light of the above I have been unable to attach any negligent act or omission on the part of the company and/or or its employees. Regretfully, SP Energy Networks are unable to consider any claim on this occasion. Once again, may I apologise for the inconvenience you have experienced as a result of the supply interruption and assure you of our continuing efforts to maintain a safe and reliable supply of electricity to your property.

I ended up claiming on the house insurance, probably get hammered now on annual premiums, which will be annoying as we haven't claimed in 42 year of cover!

As for future protection, I am going to get a APC Line R1200 Automatic Voltage Regulator. 

The new Naim Muso QB should arrive tomorrow. I can't tell you how much I've missed it!