AxeFX & Kemper - thinking the unthinkable and selling my soul to the devil

Jonathanthomas83

Thanks @Cabicular ; and @guitarfishbay I tried a TS in front but yeah, maybe EQ and a different cab (I think it was the mic actually, probably defaulted to a ribbon mic of some kind). Thanks guys, will try again!

Cabicular

For that particular sound the ownhammer free mesa IR is pretty good
as someone who constantly says the Helix cabs are good enough if there is something you specifically want then you can save a bit of time going directly to The IR of the mic and cab you want
This will be no surprise to you but the cab and mic are probably the biggest tonal component of the FRFR experience with the Helix so time spent here is worth it

guitarfishbay

Having owned a real Rectifier, I do think a big part of the Red/Modern tone comes from the pairing of the amp to the matching cab.  Before I got the 4x12 I had a Blackstar 4x12, which in terms of dimensions is nearly identical, but has Regular V30s instead of Mesa V30s.  When I got the Mesa 4x12 I sold the Blackstar pretty quickly.  It's still a good cab, but the way the fizz is voiced on a Recto IMO pairs best with the Mesa V30s.  It makes it crunchier rather than fizzy, if that makes sense.

If you want it brighter then the Mesa 2x12 cab sounds like a more aggressive and tight version of the 4x12.  I have 2 of them and the Ownhammer IRs of it are very representative.

keir

Random Kemper question......

Can you run 2 amps at the same time or is it strictly mono?

Drew_TNBD

keir said:

Random Kemper question......

Can you run 2 amps at the same time or is it strictly mono?

Just one iirc.

Jonathanthomas83

@guitarfishbay I liked those screen shots, loads to mess about with on there.

About the delays and reverbs, Is it possible to do something like dotted quarters on the second delay or do you just have to work out the millisecond value?

For the reverbs, can you add pitch and modulation or somehow route the reverb block theough a pitch block to make the reverb only signal do something like a minor 3rd or other chosen intervals?

The reverbs are the only thing I've not heard much of in the Axe demos I've heard so I'm really interested to hear your thoughts on how the reverbs sound.

Finally, do you have an AX8 or an Axe FX?

many thanks 

Beexter

@Jonathanthomas83   I'm only a week into the AX8 ownership but regarding delay tempo choices,  it's mental. There is literally a whole screenful of choices with dotted whatever you like. I'll see if I can do a screengrab tomorrow. 

You can stick the reverb wherever you wsnt- series, parallel and run anything before or after- the flexibility and sounds are terrific. 

Jonathanthomas83

@Beexter that'd be perfect, thank you! How are you enjoying the AX8? 

Drew_TNBD

The Axe FX is amazing. The Kemper is amazing. The Helix is amazing.

@Digitalscream sent me a clip today of his Bogner Red into an AMT F-1 pedal. It sounded amazing.

Tools aren't the be-all and end all... make some music dudes!!

Bridgehouse

Drew_TNBD said:

The Axe FX is amazing. The Kemper is amazing. The Helix is amazing.

@Digitalscream sent me a clip today of his Bogner Red into an AMT F-1 pedal. It sounded amazing.

Tools aren't the be-all and end all... make some music dudes!!

A-fucking-men!

BintyTwanger77

Bridgehouse said:

Drew_TNBD said:

The Axe FX is amazing. The Kemper is amazing. The Helix is amazing.

@Digitalscream sent me a clip today of his Bogner Red into an AMT F-1 pedal. It sounded amazing.

Tools aren't the be-all and end all... make some music dudes!!

A-fucking-men!

Eventide is amazing, Strymon is amazing, all of the above are amazing, it's ALL amazing.

YOU are all amazing!

I'm not drunk, by the way...

Beexter

@Jonathanthomas83  - screen grab of the tempo settings from AX8 - 

<a href="http://imgur.com/bHkNoRE"><img src="http://i.imgur.com/bHkNoRE.jpg" title="source: imgur.com" /></a>

Still in the honeymoon period but liking what I'm hearing so far. It's pretty straightforward to use at a "simple" level - ie. putting together a simple chain of amp, cab and effects but the level of control and options for deep editing are there if you want to, enabling you to do stuff in "modelling world" that would either be impossible, time consuming or expensive to do in the real world. 

There was a fairly interesting Guitarist video recently where a bunch of pro-users were discussing the capabilities and benefits of the high end modellers. The key take-away for me was that when you use their full modelling capabilities and run through a FRFR speaker - they will ALL sound different to an amp in a room, but that's the point. Used in this way, they are modelling the sound of a mic'd amp and cab. If you mic up up an amp/cab in an isolation room and feed that signal through to monitors in a control room and then compare THAT tone to a modeller, it is likely to be indistinguishable. If you want "amp in a room" response, sound and feel, then disable cab sims on the modeller, run a preamp signal from the modeller into a power amp and guitar cab.

As has been stated endlessly, they're all good and all capable of superb sounds. Watch a load of demos, read the respective manuals and decide which one ticks your boxes.

Jonathanthomas83

Beexter said:

@Jonathanthomas83  - screen grab of the tempo settings from AX8 - 

<a href="http://imgur.com/bHkNoRE"><img src="http://i.imgur.com/bHkNoRE.jpg" title="source: imgur.com" /></a>

Still in the honeymoon period but liking what I'm hearing so far. It's pretty straightforward to use at a "simple" level - ie. putting together a simple chain of amp, cab and effects but the level of control and options for deep editing are there if you want to, enabling you to do stuff in "modelling world" that would either be impossible, time consuming or expensive to do in the real world. 

There was a fairly interesting Guitarist video recently where a bunch of pro-users were discussing the capabilities and benefits of the high end modellers. The key take-away for me was that when you use their full modelling capabilities and run through a FRFR speaker - they will ALL sound different to an amp in a room, but that's the point. Used in this way, they are modelling the sound of a mic'd amp and cab. If you mic up up an amp/cab in an isolation room and feed that signal through to monitors in a control room and then compare THAT tone to a modeller, it is likely to be indistinguishable. If you want "amp in a room" response, sound and feel, then disable cab sims on the modeller, run a preamp signal from the modeller into a power amp and guitar cab.

As has been stated endlessly, they're all good and all capable of superb sounds. Watch a load of demos, read the respective manuals and decide which one ticks your boxes.

That list of tempo settings is huge! So much fun!

Yep, I'm sorted, made my mind up and will be picking it up tomorrow.

That bit about the isolation cab sound mic'd up...that's definitely the thing that people forget/don't realise. 

Perfect, thank you!

guitarfishbay

Jonathanthomas83 said:

For the reverbs, can you add pitch and modulation or somehow route the reverb block theough a pitch block to make the reverb only signal do something like a minor 3rd or other chosen intervals?

The reverbs are the only thing I've not heard much of in the Axe demos I've heard so I'm really interested to hear your thoughts on how the reverbs sound.

Finally, do you have an AX8 or an Axe FX?

I've got an Axe FX 2 XL.  

I honestly haven't done much serious experimenting with the reverbs as I mostly use delay.

The only time I use reverb in my patches is before distortion for that massive wash effect.  The reverbs do sound very good IMO, and there are two quality settings.  The regular quality sounds fine, the higher quality is very nice but you'll only really appreciate the difference through monitors IMO.  The higher setting uses more CPU.  

I don't think the reverbs have pitch built in to the effect but you can always set up a parallel path with a pitch effect.  I think the multidelay can do some pitch stuff

You can hear it in the start of this video



I'd be interested in your thoughts once you've picked your unit up.

guitarfishbay

Yeah skip to 6:50 in that video and he starts messing with it

Jonathanthomas83

@guitarfishbay amazing, thanks very much! :-)

I can't wait to get it, will let you know how I get on!  

Beexter

2nd band rehearsal with the AX8 tonight...I'm now 1 week into ownership and getting more and more comfortable with it. I've tweaked a few presets from last week and the biggest difference by far has been adjusting the hi and lo cuts on the cab block - made a massive difference and it sounded and felt great tonight. Used a Yamaha DXR10 behind me which worked a treat. 
I've been setting up my patches through the Yamaha at bedroom volume at home and was very surprised at how they translated at rehearsal volume - very little adjustment was needed.
A very happy camper so far....

Clarky

Drew_TNBD said:

The Axe FX is amazing. The Kemper is amazing. The Helix is amazing.

@Digitalscream sent me a clip today of his Bogner Red into an AMT F-1 pedal. It sounded amazing.

Tools aren't the be-all and end all... make some music dudes!!

wis'd

Clarky

keir said:

When you play a kemper / helixdoes it feel like a real amp or does it sound / feel like a recorded amp?

it depends how you set it up…
when I'm in the studio, I use the cab blocks in the AxeFXII and I'm either monitoring through headphones or my studio monitors.. that is certainly a recorded up vibe…
when I'm rehearsing or live, cab emulation is bypassed and I run through a pair of Marshall 4x12 cabs.. that's the amp in room vibe...

Clarky

Drew_TNBD said:

keir said:

When you play a kemper / helixdoes it feel like a real amp or does it sound / feel like a recorded amp?

Well all three sound amazing. And all three feel really good. Whether they feel like your favourite amp is another thing... I mean, not all valve amps feel the same to play through, so why should all modellers? Valve amps are a different thing. Modellers are their own thing imho, and I think once you lose the mindset of 'I'm trying to replace my valve amps' then that really free's you to be creative with them.

absolutely…
and this is exactly my attitude to this…
there are so many amps and cabs in the AxeFXII that I'd be lying if I said they were all amazingly accurate because I've never played through the real thing…
I only know a handful of real amps reasonably well
the point is though.. I don't actually care..
all I care about is sounding how I want to sound.. and so I'll noodle around with various combinations of amps, cabs, fx etc until I find it..
I know without doubt that I absolutely adore my Tucana 3 clean tone even though I've never actually seen one in the flesh…
and if I saw one in a guitar shop I wouldn't even recognise it…
like you say.. the AxeFXII and others units like it are just tools…
you carve out your tone as best you can and then get on with making music..