The Stratocaster and Telecaster

Gassage

I was talking to someone who worked with Leo the other day and we were musing this....

Have you ever sat back and really considered what Leo achieved when he designed these?

They are Mona Lisas, perfection. Changed everything.

So many things were invented that we take for granted. The Strat has shaped every single solid body that followed. Nothing is more copied or is used as inspiration for others- even the modern PRS

The level of innovation Leo managed in just 5 years is bigger in Electrics than anything from then to now.

When you sit back and think about it, it's mind blowing what he achieved.

Sassafras

Then Fender go and screw it all up by putting  humbuckers in Teles and Strats.

guitarfishbay

The split coil P bass is even better... None of the controls are in an inconvenient place (like the Tele pickup switch) and you could play one in almost any genre and it'd sound right.

Gassage

guitarfishbay said:

The split coil P bass is even better... None of the controls are in an inconvenient place (like the Tele pickup switch) and you could play one in almost any genre and it'd sound right.

Leo invented the electric bass, basically.

guitars4you

I think there are merits in what you said - the most remarkable aspect about it that at the time is that Leo basically had a few jazz players, basic blues players and country players to take advice from and develop opinions from - How we use them today, following all the changes in pop/rock music over the years, then it is remarkable that neither guitar was invented with this in mind - Maybe it was the perfect accident - Yet Hank Marvin, SRV, Dave Gilmour and Jimi Hendrix effectively play the same guitar and yet sound so different - As such the Strat and Tele allows the personality of the player to shine through

Valid point that the Tele and Strat are effectively different instruments - Look at the LP from 52 on-wards and Gibson tended to start with one guitar then adopt and update as time went on over the rest of the decade - whereas the Strat and Tele are radically different in many aspects - especially trem v fixed bridge - scratchplate assembly - 3 pick-ups - contoured body 

Yet if you look at early black n white video clips of the early years of jump/jive from Big Joe Turner to early rock n roll, until Buddy Holly came along, the Strat did not sell to well - I believe comments made at the time centered around who is it for 

HAL9000

Sassafras said:

Then Fender go and screw it all up by putting  humbuckers in Teles and Strats.

I have a G&L Tele with a humbucker in the neck position and would say it's better (for me) than a single coil. I'd still want the usual Tele affair at the bridge though.

guitars4you

guitarfishbay said:

The split coil P bass is even better... None of the controls are in an inconvenient place (like the Tele pickup switch) and you could play one in almost any genre and it'd sound right.

it is told that when Leo invented the bass guitar that no suitable electric bass strings existed - could not use guitar strings, part due to thickness and part to short - Plus double bass and cello strings had gut cores so would not work - As such he apparently created metal filings, magnetized them and applied them to a far thinner string (not sure which) to test it out

fretfinder

If you wanted to be really picky you could say that upper fret access could have been better. But you can't blame him because at that time I guess few people would have imagined guitarists wanting to spend their time widdling up at the dusty end.

But basically you're right, they are two fantastic and near-perfect guitar designs, first time off the drawing board.

guitars4you

Hey remember that Leo could not play guitar

Gassage

guitars4you said:

Hey remember that Leo could not play guitar

Speedy West and Freddie Tavares used to sneak into his office and put all the guitars in Open E as they couldn't stand the discordent noises!

mudslide73

guitars4you said:

How we use them today, following all the changes in pop/rock music over the years, then it is remarkable that neither guitar was invented with this in mind 

This is true. I would say that almost all innovations in guitars since have had the Strat and Tele in mind. What pedal/amp/anything wasn't R&D'd without them?

As much as I love Les Pauls (and I do) they're a proper dog's dinner in terms of design compared to Leo's work. He got it right first time over and over again. There's never been much wrong with the Tele in any way shape or form. 

Richardj

I just love the Stratocaster.  It's name, how it looks, how it sounds, how it feels, everything.

It is astonishing how it could be so right from it's introduction.

guitarfishbay

Yes there is - the switch is too close to the controls. It could easily be fixed (and you can buy a replacement that is) but it hasn't ever been done.

Octafish

The thing about the Strat in particlular is how timeless the design is, you wouldn't think it's over 60 year old. So many of the futuristic designs form the 50's have dated badly and now look archaic, not the Strat. When i first saw Gilmour playing a Strat on TV in 1990 I thought it was a modern 80's guitar. A few years ago I asked a few non-guitar players friends if they could guess when the Strat was designed, most thought in the last 20 odd years

ICBM

guitars4you said:

Hey remember that Leo could not play guitar

That's partly why he was such an innovator - he had fewer preconceived ideas. As well as just being a natural genius, of course.

sweepy

Also, Leo didn't design the Strat, it was pretty much Freddie Tavares brainchild with Leo's input 

guitars4you

One issue I always found curious was why on a Tele use a slot head screw adjustment on the bridge saddle for the height adjustment - then use a grub screw with an allen key adjustment on the bridge saddle of a Strat - I'm led to believe it is down to Fender using different local based tooling companies for different components - who knows

Octafish

sweepy said:

Also, Leo didn't design the Strat, it was pretty much Freddie Tavares brainchild with Leo's input 

Although the Strat wasn't a clean sheet idea, it started as an evolution of the Telecaster and Leo addressing some of the complaints about it, blocky body etc

p90fool

They're works of genius no doubt, but there's a lot of backwards projection going on too.

Sometimes we think he got it right first time simply because they were invented before rock 'n' roll and were used to help create it.

This makes them almost unique among tools in that they were invented before their primary use was thought of, so of course any radical deviation will seem somehow wrong. 

To illustrate; Hank Marvin sounded like that because Leo forced him to, not because Hank had an exact sound in his head that Genius Leo managed to turn into reality.

It was a series of happy accidents and some very clever design.

Gassage

guitars4you said:

One issue I always found curious was why on a Tele use a slot head screw adjustment on the bridge saddle for the height adjustment - then use a grub screw with an allen key adjustment on the bridge saddle of a Strat - I'm led to believe it is down to Fender using different local based tooling companies for different components - who knows

OK....kinda right....because Leo made the Tele bridges himself, cutting brass bar to make them

The strat saddles were made by Race and Olmstead, over the road, and they put the Allen screws in.

Question: when did Tele backplates get posidrive screws first up?

I saw DG's workmate up close in France and there's slotted screws on that (1954)

LooseMoose

When you factor in that he wasn't really a player, it's even more impressive!