Clarky and the Helix

Jonathanthomas83

Nailed it!

Drew_TNBD

guitarfishbay said:

Drew also has a whole extra set of problems on top, and the Helix is a better solution for him given how many delays he wants in a patch -  I've genuinely been trying to talk him out of GASing for either an FX8 or Axe FX 2 in recent times because I don't think it'll work for him and I reckon he'll just get frustrated by the way the units work.

I think you've failed.... I dunno, I'm not sure.... arrrggghhhhhhhh.... I've got money in my pocket burning a hole!

Jonathanthomas83

Drew_TNBD said:

guitarfishbay said:

Drew also has a whole extra set of problems on top, and the Helix is a better solution for him given how many delays he wants in a patch -  I've genuinely been trying to talk him out of GASing for either an FX8 or Axe FX 2 in recent times because I don't think it'll work for him and I reckon he'll just get frustrated by the way the units work.

I think you've failed.... I dunno, I'm not sure.... arrrggghhhhhhhh.... I've got money in my pocket burning a hole!

Haha, what's your priority? Loads of delays? I must say I've never struggled to find my sounds and I'm a delay nutjob. Multi-delay does everything I need if the regular delays fail me. Where do you live? You're more than welcome to try mine if you ever fancy it.

guitarfishbay

Jonathanthomas83 said:

Drew_TNBD said:

guitarfishbay said:

Drew also has a whole extra set of problems on top, and the Helix is a better solution for him given how many delays he wants in a patch -  I've genuinely been trying to talk him out of GASing for either an FX8 or Axe FX 2 in recent times because I don't think it'll work for him and I reckon he'll just get frustrated by the way the units work.

I think you've failed.... I dunno, I'm not sure.... arrrggghhhhhhhh.... I've got money in my pocket burning a hole!

Haha, what's your priority? Loads of delays? I must say I've never struggled to find my sounds and I'm a delay nutjob. Multi-delay does everything I need if the regular delays fail me. Where do you live? You're more than welcome to try mine if you ever fancy it.

He's the Delay Lama.

He want's to be the One With Everything.

guitarfishbay

Drew_TNBD said:

guitarfishbay said:

Drew also has a whole extra set of problems on top, and the Helix is a better solution for him given how many delays he wants in a patch -  I've genuinely been trying to talk him out of GASing for either an FX8 or Axe FX 2 in recent times because I don't think it'll work for him and I reckon he'll just get frustrated by the way the units work.

I think you've failed.... I dunno, I'm not sure.... arrrggghhhhhhhh.... I've got money in my pocket burning a hole!

Well I haven't failed if you've not bought it yet!

Drew_TNBD

Jonathanthomas83 said:

Drew_TNBD said:

guitarfishbay said:

Drew also has a whole extra set of problems on top, and the Helix is a better solution for him given how many delays he wants in a patch -  I've genuinely been trying to talk him out of GASing for either an FX8 or Axe FX 2 in recent times because I don't think it'll work for him and I reckon he'll just get frustrated by the way the units work.

I think you've failed.... I dunno, I'm not sure.... arrrggghhhhhhhh.... I've got money in my pocket burning a hole!

Haha, what's your priority? Loads of delays? I must say I've never struggled to find my sounds and I'm a delay nutjob. Multi-delay does everything I need if the regular delays fail me. Where do you live? You're more than welcome to try mine if you ever fancy it.

Basically I'm umming and aahing over the limitation of 2 delay blocks on the FX8. I really want to try one out and I'd love to compare it to my Helix and see what the chief differences are. But the main one is that my typical patch on the Helix uses 4 delays - two are my regular reverse+forwards setup that I've used for ages now. The other two is something I've introduced recently... two analog delays in series, with an expression pedal tied to the feedback of the first one... and these two sit in a parallel path with a compressor, an EQ, and a reverb.... and I bring this chain in and out depending on the scene I am on.

It's basically for doing this kind of thing (1:03):


I've been trying to replicate that sort of oscillation with my Timeline, Nemesis, and DD500.. they can't really do it in the same way.

guitarfishbay

Does the FX8 get 2 delay blocks and multi delay, or just 2 delay blocks total?

I've never really tried to do the kind of stuff you're trying to do, I've barely played with the multi delay apart from when it got input diffusion this year

Drew_TNBD

guitarfishbay said:

Does the FX8 get 2 delay blocks and multi delay, or just 2 delay blocks total?

I've never really tried to do the kind of stuff you're trying to do, I've barely played with the multi delay apart from when it got input diffusion this year

2 delay blocks, 1 multi-delay, and 1 mega-tap delay.

guitarfishbay

Huh I didn't even know there was a mega tap delay.  Shows how much I use delay then eh!

Drew_TNBD

guitarfishbay said:

Huh I didn't even know there was a mega tap delay.  Shows how much I use delay then eh!

So what I'm thinking is, is it possible to do the reverse and forwards delays with the multi and meta-tap models, and if so can you get all four in 1 patch and how much is the CPU hit?

guitarfishbay

I can take a look later. I've no idea what can be reversed or not, it isn't a sound I use

guitarfishbay

I found this but it's way out of date.  I think they're up to FW 5 now.

http://axefxtutorials.com/2016/01/fx8-cpu-usage-of-all-blocks-types-fw-3-00-public-beta-vs-2-00/

guitarfishbay

I've got no idea what happened in FW4, but FW5 has 1-3% CPU efficiency improvement according to this.

https://forum.fractalaudio.com/threads/fx8-v5-03-released.128790/

Clarky

John_A said:

Clarky said:

Jonathanthomas83 said:

Not wishing to jump on the bandwagon, but again, after trying Native out over the weekend, I've been left wanting the feel under my fingers that I get from the Axe FX. Between that and the response of the pick attack, I think that's a better description of how different I feel the two units are than the reasons I gave before, which perhaps sounded a little unsubstantiated. They are different, to my ears and personally, I prefer the Axe FX for my needs.

when you hear recordings folks post of the two units they do sound roughly on a par..
close enough for someone to easily think that either can pip the other at the post - subjective..

but listening ain't the same as playing..
and on a similar theme
this is exactly how I felt about the Axe's VH4 ch3 model vs the real one..
the Axe made the noise of the real one but could never quite find it's special feel..
the feel of the VH4 ch3 in the Axe has for me always been illusive..

its funny, I have no issues at all with the feel of the Helix amps.  Now I've spent some time with it, I think the mix coming back through my monitor feels the same as when I used a mic'd up 4x12,   I do know you are a much more experienced than I am, and a better player, but I hope this isn't the start of a 1000 posts on TGP of 'the Helix doesn't feel right compared to the AxeFX'

I've spent more time wit the Helix than the AxeFX, but my opinion is I like it better, when I used the AxeFX everything I played felt stiff, to me the Helix feels better.

This is all subjective I know, I just hope your post doesn't put people off

to be honest it makes no difference how good you are..
tone choices, technique and touch are personal things..
if it wasn't this way we'd all have the same amp and guitar
so your observations are just as valid as anyone else's

Clarky

Drew_TNBD said:

I don't have much of a problem with the feel tbh. It feels amp like to me. It's not as good as my diezel through a 4x12 but then nothing is.

Real amps are king for feel. To my mind this indisputable.

real Diezels have a special magic I've never found in any other amp

Clarky

Sporky said:

Clarky said:

I'd like input level control over a delay and a reverb.. not a delay or a reverb… aaaahhghhhhh ! ! ! !

I think you could do that with a full-fat Helix and some patch leads to split the paths. I'll have a play this evening.

I'll be interested to see what you come up with…
this is intriguing

Clarky

Jonathanthomas83 said:

John_A said:

I do know you are a much more experienced than I am, and a better player, but I hope this isn't the start of a 1000 posts on TGP of 'the Helix doesn't feel right compared to the AxeFX'

I've spent more time wit the Helix than the AxeFX, but my opinion is I like it better, when I used the AxeFX everything I played felt stiff, to me the Helix feels better.

This is all subjective I know, I just hope your post doesn't put people off

It's all opinion though isn't it, being hopeful that certain posts won't put others off a product is a little bit of a moot point when you're pretty much saying the same thing inversely about the Axe FX.

Case in point was a couple of days ago people were saying that the Axe FX fans are too noisy. Personally, I noticed it when I first switched the unit on back in March, but even at low volume playing nowadays, I can't say I ever notice the fan on mine. Granted, the Axe FX has probably helped ruin my hearing even further! haha. Point is, people will always have an opinion on these things, it's up to us to figure out what's best for our needs :-)

I have 2 Axe units sat 2' from me right now
one of them is almost silent, the other is not

Drew_TNBD

Clarky said:

Jonathanthomas83 said:

John_A said:

I do know you are a much more experienced than I am, and a better player, but I hope this isn't the start of a 1000 posts on TGP of 'the Helix doesn't feel right compared to the AxeFX'

I've spent more time wit the Helix than the AxeFX, but my opinion is I like it better, when I used the AxeFX everything I played felt stiff, to me the Helix feels better.

This is all subjective I know, I just hope your post doesn't put people off

It's all opinion though isn't it, being hopeful that certain posts won't put others off a product is a little bit of a moot point when you're pretty much saying the same thing inversely about the Axe FX.

Case in point was a couple of days ago people were saying that the Axe FX fans are too noisy. Personally, I noticed it when I first switched the unit on back in March, but even at low volume playing nowadays, I can't say I ever notice the fan on mine. Granted, the Axe FX has probably helped ruin my hearing even further! haha. Point is, people will always have an opinion on these things, it's up to us to figure out what's best for our needs :-)

I have 2 Axe units sat 2' from me right now
one of them is almost silent, the other is not

What's the reason for that?

Sporky

Clarky said:

Sporky said:

Clarky said:

I'd like input level control over a delay and a reverb.. not a delay or a reverb… aaaahhghhhhh ! ! ! !

I think you could do that with a full-fat Helix and some patch leads to split the paths. I'll have a play this evening.

I'll be interested to see what you come up with…
this is intriguing

The basic idea is that you use patch leads between FX sends and returns, then use send and return blocks in the paths to split paths into multiple sections. Then you could assign an expression pedal (fer instance) to change the send level into a reverb in one bit of the path and the send level into a delay in another bit of the path.

It makes sense in my head at least.

Jonathanthomas83

@Drew_TNBD can you explain how you built that and I can try to replicate it. How are you keeping the oscillation going whilst you start the regular delayed signal again? I'm guessing you're just turning that delay off and keeping the trails?