Not great guitarists who are nevertheless perfect for the band they're in

springhead

Grocer_Jack said:

TheBigDipper said:

carlos said:

Sassafras said:

John McGeoch wasn't what I'd call a virtuoso but he was incredibly inventive and original so he fitted the Banshees perfectly.
Same with Hugh Cornwell.

The first I thought of. Also liked him in PIL

And before those, in Magazine. Excellent playing to the song. 

My old band used to do Shot By Both Sides - the first few bars of the solo in the middle are not easy! I reckon I played it 50 or 60 times on stage and never got it quite right. 

Agreed. McGeoch was an excellent guitarist. We play Shot By Both Sides and it’s a bitch to nail properly. Guthrie, Vai etc might be able to play his parts and solo’s easily because of their amazing technical guitarist skills - but they would never have imagined and created those parts.  That’s the difference. 

ICBM

Jez6345789 said:

I pretty much disagree with the whole concept of this thread and a good number of the players listed. Fine if you place technical ability above all else.

i would far prefer to listen to most of the so called adequate for their band players 

like Gilmour, Keef, Alomar etc than a night of Guthrie. Who is only really liked by guitarist. I am bored by the third track, once you get past the oh he can do xxx for all his chops he is boring as **** to listen too. 

But each to to their own 

I didn’t say anything about not liking them... I meant it as a compliment - Peter Buck is one of my main influences. I tend not to like ‘good guitarists’, I much prefer musicians who play for the song, regardless of how technically good they are.

Hattigol

EricTheWeary said:i

The person who comes to mind is Lynval Golding of The Specials. He did some twiddly bits but tended to be a strictly rythmn guy with about four chord shapes. It does mean you can work out the chord changes to almost any Specials song by watching his left hand. 

That's the thing about reggae. The guitar is the rhythm section. The bass does the fills.

Or so Sir Horace Gentleman once told me.

dogload

It's a question of deciding where being technically excellent becomes more desirable to being creative and interesting. Most (if not all) of the guitarists that I consider to be influences would probably be shot down for lack of technical proficiency, but they have created some brilliant music.

Personally, I'd rather hear a not very technical guitarist clunking through three chords and contributing to an interesting piece of music than any of these technical wizards widdling away. 

But, keeping on thread, I offer Will Sergeant of The Bunnymen and Dave Brock of Hawkwind.

JayGee

I seem to be doing a lot of wising on this thread :-)

After due consideration my joint nomination is Parfitt and Rossi by the way - In spite of the apparent simplicity[1] while I’m sure there are plenty of guitarists out there who could play those songs and parts there aren’t many who’ve created as many instantly recognisable stone-cold classic hits..

[1] Having tried to learn a few of them properly it’s become clear that a lot of the time there’s actually rather more going on in there than is apparent...

crunchman

JayGee said:

I seem to be doing a lot of wising on this thread :-)

After due consideration my joint nomination is Parfitt and Rossi by the way - In spite of the apparent simplicity[1] while I’m sure there are plenty of guitarists out there who could play those songs and parts there aren’t many who’ve created as many instantly recognisable stone-cold classic hits..

[1] Having tried to learn a few of them properly it’s become clear that a lot of the time there’s actually rather more going on in there than is apparent...

Also, how many of us have the stamina to keep chugging away like Parfitt did?  That's not easy. 

Octafish

Eric Clapton and Derek & the Dominos - boring, unoriginal, one dimensional guitarist, perfect for Derek & the Dominos

EricTheWeary

Hattigol said:

EricTheWeary said:i

The person who comes to mind is Lynval Golding of The Specials. He did some twiddly bits but tended to be a strictly rythmn guy with about four chord shapes. It does mean you can work out the chord changes to almost any Specials song by watching his left hand. 

That's the thing about reggae. The guitar is the rhythm section. The bass does the fills.

Or so Sir Horace Gentleman once told me.

It's interesting in as much as what you don't know if he's decided that what works for the band is a handful of barre chord shapes and that's his job so why play anything different. There are moments when he does jazzy octave runs so I know his fingers can create different shapes. I guess that's for most of the guitarists mentioned on this thread - are they limited by what they know and have just made it fit or are they limited by what works? As has been said I think we also have an odd idea of what simple is and being a Lynval Golding or a Rick Parfitt for two hours is hard work.
 
I remember an old BB King interview where he's sat playing a jazzy chord progression on guitar ( he was also a decent pianist) and then says something like nobody's paying to hear me play that. 

Octafish

stimpsonslostson said:

Johnny Ramone

Jimmy Page- he gets a LOT of stick around here. Sloppy technique, poor timing etc. Personally I think he's great BECAUSE of this looseness! 

To me most of Page's sloppiness is confined to his live playing and because he was wacked out of his face of clarky-cat. I wouldn't have called the epic layered up guitars on something like Achilles Last Stand as sloppy. I think you're right about a bit looseness, particlularly when grinding out riffs

Creed_Clicks

Kerry King. His solos sound really sh*t, but seems to fit the Slayer sound.

Grocer_Jack

dogload said:

It's a question of deciding where being technically excellent becomes more desirable to being creative and interesting. Most (if not all) of the guitarists that I consider to be influences would probably be shot down for lack of technical proficiency, but they have created some brilliant music.

Personally, I'd rather hear a not very technical guitarist clunking through three chords and contributing to an interesting piece of music than any of these technical wizards widdling away. 

But, keeping on thread, I offer Will Sergeant of The Bunnymen and Dave Brock of Hawkwind.

Will Sergeant - yes!!  The other week at a gig I was very chuffed when someone said I sounded like him. I don't think I do particularly, but I'll take it!!
Mind you, at the same gig I was cornered by two blokes who insisted that I used to be in Dr. Feelgood.
Them: "Hey, we saw you in Dr Feelgood" 
Me: "I wasn't in Dr. Feelgood! "
Bloke 1: "No, you were. We saw you didn't we Kev?"
Bloke 2: "Yes, we saw you in Dr.Feelgood"
Me: "I wasn't in Dr. Feelgood"
Bloke 1 "where did we see him, Kev?"

Grocer_Jack

Maybe there's a new thread in this! 

Johnnyseven

Thurston Moore and Lee Renaldo

Johnnyseven

Neil Young

Sassafras

For all those who don't rate Wilko Johnson, try playing a 2 hour set in his style. I reckon you'd be exhausted by the 3rd song.
We used to play Roxette and I found the relentless driving rhythm very demanding.

BintyTwanger77

Octafish said:

Eric Clapton and Derek & the Dominos - boring, unoriginal, one dimensional guitarist, perfect for Derek & the Dominos

Cream vs. everything he did after, like night and day. He will never sound as incredible as he did with Baker and Bruce.

Grocer_Jack

Sassafras said:

For all those who don't rate Wilko Johnson, try playing a 2 hour set in his style. I reckon you'd be exhausted by the 3rd song.
We used to play Roxette and I found the relentless driving rhythm very demanding.

Yes! Also he used to do it while doing star jumps, the splits and that special robot dance thing. 

Gassage

Hugh Cornwell.

Utterly awful but suited the Stranglers where a virtuoso bass and keys player masked his hopeless slashing telecaster playing.

lasermonkey

In terms of not particularly proficient guitarists but are actually great* guitarists, I'd have to say-

Peter Buck. I've heard a lot of people say, "even *I* could play that!" to which I respond, "yeah, but you didn't."

Reg Smithies and Dave Fielding from The Chameleons. Invented a completely new version of guitar interplay which hasn't been bettered since.

John McGeough. You try writing Spellbound. Genius.

Robin Guthrie. Very few guitarists invent entire genres. I can't think of anyone who has made the guitar sound more beautiful.

*To me, a great guitarist (or musician) is someone who knows that the song is king. They'll play exactly what's needed in the context of the piece of music and nothing more.

Haych

Kirk Hammett.... borderline mind - is he really perfect for Metallica or would they have been just as good without him?