Les Paul style Guitar - PAF or P90?

Keefy

No pickup is a guaranteed win if the guitar itself doesn’t respond with dynamics, the pickups can only work with what’s there already. I’m thinking of a P90-powered Les Paul I tried once - just dull and thuddy, because that was the sound of the guitar itself.

I’m thinking you probably want a different guitar - flog the LP and buy a Trent Model 1.

slacker

I have the opposite problem, I often swap guitars at home but when I take a guitar out I can make it work. 

Imho p90s and PAFs are similar in sound and I find them interchangeable, especially when using gain.

There a tps that shows how to set up an amp and how different pickups react to the settings.

See if you can borrow a paf a like loaded les pal and see if that works. You've changed pickups, change the guitar. Borrow a different amp. Etc.

usedtobe

One of each. Got to be.

Cirrus

Well...

A couple of practices and a lot of playing at home later, P90s are not the pickups I'm looking for.

They're great, they're raw and have lots of character, and they're more dynamic but... they're actually higher output than the PAFs I'd been trying, and they have more midrange and bottom end. Which which kind of pushed them in the opposite direction to what I was looking for, and meant they weren't as different sounding as I thought they might be.

So if anyone wants an almost new set of humbucker size p90s...

In the meantime I've put the stock humbuckers back in. Both 7.35k, with (I think) ceramic magnets. And you know what? They're fine. They don't have the rich thickness than A2 PAFs have, but they're uncompressed and clear, and actually with more than a little distortion I think they have some advantages over everything else I've tried - that clarity turns into a nice upper mid grind with openness. It'd be absolutely typical if I spent £450 on pickups only to end up back at the stock ones.

ICBM

Cirrus said:

Well...

A couple of practices and a lot of playing at home later, P90s are not the pickups I'm looking for.

They're great, they're raw and have lots of character, and they're more dynamic but... they're actually higher output than the PAFs I'd been trying, and they have more midrange and bottom end. Which which kind of pushed them in the opposite direction to what I was looking for, and meant they weren't as different sounding as I thought they might be.

So if anyone wants an almost new set of humbucker size p90s...

In the meantime I've put the stock humbuckers back in. Both 7.35k, with (I think) ceramic magnets. And you know what? They're fine. They don't have the rich thickness than A2 PAFs have, but they're uncompressed and clear, and actually with more than a little distortion I think they have some advantages over everything else I've tried - that clarity turns into a nice upper mid grind with openness. It'd be absolutely typical if I spent £450 on pickups only to end up back at the stock ones.

I told you P90s have more mids .

Really, try Alnico 5 PAF-type humbuckers - they'll be about halfway between the A2s and the ceramics.

Unless the stock ones are A5 anyway, which from your description of the sound I think they might be... in which case I'm not at all surprised .

TTBZ

Cirrus said:

It'd be absolutely typical if I spent £450 on pickups only to end up back at the stock ones.

I've done exactly this with my SG dread to think how much I've spent on pickups only to end up buying back a 490R/498T set (sold the original ones)! 

impmann

A2 humbuckers can sound horribly mushy in some guitars.
A5 can give a bit of a lift, as ICBM says.

I still think a Les Paul is the wrong guitar for what you’re trying to achieve, though 

poopot

Cirrus said:

Well...

A couple of practices and a lot of playing at home later, P90s are not the pickups I'm looking for.

They're great, they're raw and have lots of character, and they're more dynamic but... they're actually higher output than the PAFs I'd been trying, and they have more midrange and bottom end. Which which kind of pushed them in the opposite direction to what I was looking for, and meant they weren't as different sounding as I thought they might be.

So if anyone wants an almost new set of humbucker size p90s...

In the meantime I've put the stock humbuckers back in. Both 7.35k, with (I think) ceramic magnets. And you know what? They're fine. They don't have the rich thickness than A2 PAFs have, but they're uncompressed and clear, and actually with more than a little distortion I think they have some advantages over everything else I've tried - that clarity turns into a nice upper mid grind with openness. It'd be absolutely typical if I spent £450 on pickups only to end up back at the stock ones.

If it sounds good it sounds good… Sod what the internets say dude!… 

Cirrus

ICBM said:

Cirrus said:

Well...

A couple of practices and a lot of playing at home later, P90s are not the pickups I'm looking for.

They're great, they're raw and have lots of character, and they're more dynamic but... they're actually higher output than the PAFs I'd been trying, and they have more midrange and bottom end. Which which kind of pushed them in the opposite direction to what I was looking for, and meant they weren't as different sounding as I thought they might be.

So if anyone wants an almost new set of humbucker size p90s...

In the meantime I've put the stock humbuckers back in. Both 7.35k, with (I think) ceramic magnets. And you know what? They're fine. They don't have the rich thickness than A2 PAFs have, but they're uncompressed and clear, and actually with more than a little distortion I think they have some advantages over everything else I've tried - that clarity turns into a nice upper mid grind with openness. It'd be absolutely typical if I spent £450 on pickups only to end up back at the stock ones.

I told you P90s have more mids .

Really, try Alnico 5 PAF-type humbuckers - they'll be about halfway between the A2s and the ceramics.

Unless the stock ones are A5 anyway, which from your description of the sound I think they might be... in which case I'm not at all surprised .

Sorry for the nested quotes, writing on my mobile...

You did! So, what's a good low wind a5 Humbucker then?

ICBM

Cirrus said:

You did! So, what's a good low wind a5 Humbucker then?

Duncan '59s.

I like a much hotter bridge pickup personally, so I'd go for a Custom 5 there, but the '59B is probably what you want - it's just very slightly hotter than the '59N.

TeleMaster

I find that I can’t really tell how an amp, pickups, a guitar performs until I get them into a band scenario so I’ll wait to pass any judgement until I have practice. 

Maybe if you get together with your band you might think they’re better than they are at home?

Cirrus

Update:

Last week I got a Dimarzio Air Classic bridge to try at really like it. That's A5, and a little less output than the A2pro so about where I want it. Nice upper end that's bright without being sharp, clear low end, and no big midrange bloat which I don't think works for the guitar or my style.

I've got a neck version coming from America, and hopefully I can put the pickup question to bed and start enjoying what is, to be fair to it, a really lovely guitar.

Zoonyboy

PAFs and a good amp.

Cirrus

Yep, neck Dimarzio Air Classic arrived and I think I'm there.

Cirrus

I thought I was there, but by chance I found some T-Top style pickups from a company called Fletcher Pickups - I'd not heard of them before, but I have always wanted to try T-Tops and the maker lives 5 minutes from me, so... they're in the guitar as of a couple of hours ago. And they seem really cool.

7.5/7.7k, alnico 3. Open, uncompressed, a bit of PAF-like mids but more grit/grind in the distorted sound.

I mean I won't know what I really think of them for a few weeks but...

Neilybob

I loaded my MIJ Burny Les Paul with NOS paper in oil capacitors and a set of cream coloured Monty's PAF's. Everything else was stock. 

The tone is amazing now! 

lovestrat74

Goldfoils if you are looking for more dynamics

merlin

T-armonds or Filter'trons all over it. Job done

PAL

P90s are great but obviously come with noise when using gain it might be worth checking out the mini humbucker pickups
  you can see demos on YouTube.

timmypix

Cirrus said:

I thought I was there, but by chance I found some T-Top style pickups from a company called Fletcher Pickups - I'd not heard of them before, but I have always wanted to try T-Tops and the maker lives 5 minutes from me, so... they're in the guitar as of a couple of hours ago. And they seem really cool.

7.5/7.7k, alnico 3. Open, uncompressed, a bit of PAF-like mids but more grit/grind in the distorted sound.

I mean I won't know what I really think of them for a few weeks but...

I've been wanting to try Fletcher stuff for a while, and had a brief chat with him at the Guitar Show. He does pickups as a hobby alongside his main job, so he's a bit cheaper than a lot of the UK winders. A3 is an unsung hero in humbuckers, it's got a really nice characteristic. Look forward to hearing your thoughts once you've lived with them for a bit.