Amp Modelling Sucks

Cabicular

Tone and feel are one of the most subjective things you can have
Also what suits one player doesn't suit the other
I have a very dynamic style of loud volume with backed off playing
So when I dig in I get the punch I need. But in primarily a live guitarist so a lot of my habits have developed through that
The Helix setup suits me fine . It captures the dynamics very very well
The only caveat is it took me a long time to work out how to get what I want from it (it's simple but complicated at the same time) and the other main one which is that it has been sitting in Line6 service centre for the last two weeks waiting for a new preamp board as the last one burned out
That's not great...

Strat_a_tat_tat

Cabicular said:

... it has been sitting in Line6 service centre for the last two weeks waiting for a new preamp board as the last one burned out
That's not great...

Insufficient stock of spare parts?  If so... not good.

Cabicular

They have insufficient stocks of everything at the moment
The units are selling quicker than they can get them on the shelves

Strat_a_tat_tat

Cabicular said:

They have insufficient stocks of everything at the moment
The units are selling quicker than they can get them on the shelves

Yes, I understand that is the case... but manufacturers are free to make their own decisions on how many production items go into satisfying new customers and how many bits and pieces are retained to look after existing customers that may suffer a failure.

sweepy

The Helix is still the best affordable option imho, my old offer still stands, anyone wanting to have a sit down for a reasonable length of time and try out a Helix is more than welcome to pop over, just bring Hob Nobs or a similar quality comestible

Strat_a_tat_tat

@sweepy... very public-spirited of you... or are you just a Hob Nob Hustler?

paulmapp8306

Use what suits.  For me, AFX direct for recording, AFX into Fryette for home practice, and band stuff where variety is important (as punters dont care).  Proper valve amp for "me" or when I need a couple of basic tones and can wind them up.

The "valve" amp currently is a Machete, but its a stop gap.  Been trying loads, and currently have it down to a Dr Z Maz 18, Friedman Buxom Betty, something from Jackson Toneworks  - or possibly a Suhr PT, which I havent tried yet.  The last one goes outside the "quality single channel hand wired" ethos I really want - but Octatonic raves so must be worth trying.

digitalscream

I have to say, the closest I've got to an amp-like tone from modelling gear was when I had my Eleven Rack running into a Marshall 20/20 power amp. Nothing solid state seemed to do the job as well as that....but it really did sound fantastic. All the flexibility of a modeller, but keeping the "boom" of a valve amp.

Unfortunately, the Eleven has far too many problems to be a practical gigging setup.

I'm both a bit gutted and a bit relieved that my GSP1101's amp models are - for the most part - a bit crap. I'm using it in 4CM with my Kraken for effects and - in one song - a clean preamp, which is passable. It's the only effects unit at a reasonable price which does the 4CM job perfectly, and I don't want to be tempted back down the modelling route.

fretmeister

My only real problem with modelling is the entire "start again" approach. So the unit, power amps, then either guitar cabs or FRFR cabs. Then with a lot of the units, Helix notwithstanding, the foot controllers are a lot of extra money too.

It's just a huge amount to spend to assemble a pro level modelling rig. £700 odd for the Fractal controller? That's madness!

thomasross20

I haven't tried enough valve amps

Strat_a_tat_tat

thomasross20 said:

I haven't tried enough valve amps

None of us have!  It's a lifetime's work.

ElectroDan

fretmeister;982705" said:

My only real problem with modelling is the entire "start again" approach. So the unit, power amps, then either guitar cabs or FRFR cabs. Then with a lot of the units, Helix notwithstanding, the foot controllers are a lot of extra money too.

It's just a huge amount to spend to assemble a pro level modelling rig. £700 odd for the Fractal controller? That's madness!

I have convinced myself that I need some Fractal in my life and was thinking the same thing about starting over. But after hearing some of the recent discussions here about needing a valve power amp, I'm thinking of maybe keeping the amp and going into the fx return.
I'm covered then if the Fractal goes down too.

Grunfeld

Drew_fx said:

I've had two Axe FX II's. Three Kempers. At least two Pod HD's. I've tried the Blackstar TVP amps, and a whole host of VST plugins... none of them set my nuts on fire like my valve amps do.

I'm not sure what I can add to this.  Just a tangent I guess.  I'm gigging most weekends and it's a covers thing.  For years I've used valve amps but recently I've switched to SS.  It's different.  The stupid thing is that it's not better or worse... it's just different.  The band haven't been bothered; the punters definitely haven't been bothered.  Only me.

I kind of feel like I'm enduring this phase.  A sort of how to make the most out of your limited resources amp.  (And I can obviously manage it.)  But I want my valves back. 

axisus

horses for courses. There's a place for everything. 

Clarky

I'm a happy pixie with my Axe-II..

love it ta bits I duzz

sweepy

I am an absolute hussy for the heady mix of biscuit and chocolate , but I know from experience that 10 mins in a shop gives you no hope in hell of seeing what a unit like a Helix can do

Drew_TNBD

Grunfeld said:

Drew_fx said:

I've had two Axe FX II's. Three Kempers. At least two Pod HD's. I've tried the Blackstar TVP amps, and a whole host of VST plugins... none of them set my nuts on fire like my valve amps do.

I'm not sure what I can add to this.  Just a tangent I guess.  I'm gigging most weekends and it's a covers thing.  For years I've used valve amps but recently I've switched to SS.  It's different.  The stupid thing is that it's not better or worse... it's just different.  The band haven't been bothered; the punters definitely haven't been bothered.  Only me.

I kind of feel like I'm enduring this phase.  A sort of how to make the most out of your limited resources amp.  (And I can obviously manage it.)  But I want my valves back. 

I know exactly what you mean. It's why I'm on my 2nd Sig X amp!!

Roland

For me it's not about the last 5% of sound. It's:

1. Reliable sound irrespective of room size and pa/backline mix. Not identical, but reliable.

2. Reliable equipment. No valves to fail, and no auditioning replacements.

3. Not having to wait for the valves to cool before I pack up.

4. Less weight to carry.

Yes, I agree that modelled sound is not identical to a valve amp and cabinet in the room. It's different. Whether you accept it or not depends on what you play, and where you play, and what element of the sound is important to you. I've been trying to go solid state since the 70s, and now I can.

When it comes to coffee I like 

Roland

fretmeister said:

It's just a huge amount to spend to assemble a pro level modelling rig. £700 odd for the Fractal controller? 

Or you could spend around £100 on an FCB1010.

If cost is a consideration then you need to factor in the cost a board load of pedals.

Drew_TNBD

Roland said:

For me it's not about the last 5% of sound. It's:

1. Reliable sound irrespective of room size and pa/backline mix. Not identical, but reliable.

2. Reliable equipment. No valves to fail, and no auditioning replacements.

3. Not having to wait for the valves to cool before I pack up.

4. Less weight to carry.

Yes, I agree that modelled sound is not identical to a valve amp and cabinet in the room. It's different. Whether you accept it or not depends on what you play, and where you play, and what element of the sound is important to you. I've been trying to go solid state since the 70s, and now I can.

When it comes to coffee I like 

I don't care about any of that to be honest. I really don't. I think the sound is more important, nay, the most important thing, and I am tired of trying other things that just result in compromise.