Amplifier Mistake (Blackstar)

thomasross20 · December 2014

fretmeister said:

I used to use a pair of 110lb (50 kg) bass cabs.

Man up !

Woah, that's HEAVY!!

Afraid I can't man up lol... I'm just not built to be carrying big bulky amps weighing over 25kg - it'll kill me!

EricTheWeary · December 2014

My mate Andy has one leg and can't carry much of anything but he regularly gigs with 2x12 or 4x10 valve combos which will be much heavier than the ID. Bit of help with the lifting and a decent trolley he gets by fine.

thomasross20 · December 2014

I'm still keen on Blackstar - sound great and reliable. Maybe head & cab would be better.

At the same time, I can't be **sed with FX loops - I just want to go straight into the amp with my pedals and use those for all FX.

ICBM · December 2014

I weigh nine and a half stone and I can lift both of my Trem-o-verbs at the same time

. Each weighs 98lb...

OK, strictly speaking that's just to get them off the ground, I couldn't go upstairs like that. I'm not Superman

. But I can easily go upstairs with one. It's an easy lift for an amp that weight because it has nice handles, smooth rounded edges and is compact and well-balanced.

If you're just not up for lifting that sort of weight, either get the ID60 combo or a head and 1x12" cab and make more trips. You can get the ID60 as a head which weighs next to nothing, or the ID100 which might be a better choice if you play loud since they will only give maximum power into 4 ohms, and most 1x12" cabs will be 8 or 16.

(If you're interested, a friend is selling a Montage 1x12" with a Classic Lead 80 in it which isn't too heavy.)

Yes, you will need to put a boost in the loop if you want it to raise the volume. Or just use one of the channels for a boosted lead sound?

thomasross20 · December 2014

Good point about just using another channel for a boosted lead sound....!

OK, I think either a TVP60 or 60W head + cab. We wont be playing mega loud venues...

Consider the 260TVP is £460 new and I have a £40+ case for it... hmmm, no, I still doubt some place like guitarguitar would allow me to trade in directly for the 60TVP.

Need to decide between head & cab or the 60TVP. Head and cab is sounding good due to lighter weight...

Can't be doing with actual valve amps. I think it's pretty much Blackstar for me. Now, how to maximise the money I get back on my practically new 260TVP

Don't know about Montage's - good? Best put the Blackstar head through a Blackstar cab?

Hell, you'd think all this would be easier in this day and age!

I'll miss the stereo effect you get in the 260 - that is REALLY amazing.

steamabacus · December 2014

Have you seen the BluGuitar Amp 1 and it's matching (weeny!) cabinet?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RhXDmxEAM6I

ThePrettyDamned · December 2014

A cab is a cab is a cab - well, not really.

The montage will probably be nicer than an ID cab. But some modelling amps actually prefer the shite speakers the cheap cabs come with, rather than the rather posher, nicer speakers other cabs get. So... Horses for courses I guess.

Montage cabs are supposed to be good, there is an import range and a UK built range iirc.

The classic lead 80 is a nice speaker, though I'm pretty much sold on v30s and t75s or whatever they're called. Mix them and listen to the awesome crunch. But maybe not with a modeller. Maybe.

ICBM · December 2014

The Montage cab is better built than the Blackstar for sure - it's ply instead of MDF - but you're right to be wary of assuming the ID will necessarily sound better through better speakers.

I tried the ID60 head through a crap Marshall Valvestate cab and a 'good' Marshall 4x12" with G12T-75s, and it was better through the cheap cab! But the 75 is quite a hollow, slightly thin and buzzy-sounding speaker so it might not have been the best comparison. Unfortunately I didn't have a V30 cab to hand or I would have tried that for sure.

Be careful about the impedance - the ID really needs 4 ohms to work at it's best. If you were going for a head and a non-Blackstar cab, that's why I would probably pick the 100, to make sure it didn't run out of puff if you use it with an 8 or especially 16-ohm cab.

I agree about stereo being wonderfully lush, but in a stage mix it doesn't really work so well so you may not miss it as much as you expect.

Bucket · December 2014

A small valve head and 1x12 would be ideal for you, I think.

I've found this recently - I went from a 25kg Blackstar combo to my Mesa Mark Five 25 (approx 6-7kg) and 1x12 cab (approx 11-13kg) and it's so much better being able to break the weight into two smaller and more manageable parts. I used to baulk at needing to carry my rig down the stairs, especially as the Blackstar only had one handle on the top. The Mesa and Zilla are a breeze by comparison.

If you like the Blackstar sound, why not check out the HT 20 head?

Jeremiah · December 2014

The Laney Cub 12 and H&K Tubemeister combo are both pretty light. (Also the Fender Pro Junior) - I think the Tubemeister is under 10kg. Don't know if they'd have enough headroom for your needs though, as they're only 15-18 watts

ElectroDan · December 2014

You could look out for a used Vox Valvetronix with Neodymium speakers. The 150 watter has loads of amp models and effects, and plenty of power. And weighs in at just over 12kgs.

I quite like the tone of them too. More than good enough in a band mix. My AD15 has had a hiding and is still going after about 5-6 years (I use it flat out at my local jam night).

Voxman · December 2014

thomasross20 said:

Damn, damn, damn.
I only recently got the Blackstar 260TVP with a cool cover to go and the footswitch... and it sounds amaaaaazing!!

BUT!! It's just too heavy and bulky for me! I had to take it to practice today and just about did my back in! I even bought a little trolley for it but it didn't help all that much.

I hear you - suffered from a badback (L4/L5 compressed vertebrae) for years. The 260TVP is actually lighter at 53lbs than my Vox Valvetronix AD120VTX at 58lbs. Hence why I don't take it out much either anymore. So, if you like the 260TVP, why not just get the 1x12 60w ID60TVP instead?

longi · December 2014

I'm in agreement. There's a big weight difference between 29 and 20 kilos. The only real choices if you don't want to do the gym thing is to learn how to lift correctly (makes a huge difference) or go for the 60 watt combo or, If you find that's still to heavy, split the weight down further and go for the separate head/cab option.

meltedbuzzbox · December 2014

I am thinking you need to overhaul the whole setup.

Ditch the PRS for a parker fly, get a pink strap, some heels and join a girl band :-P

or man up and run 2 twins in stereo :-P

thomasross20 · December 2014

Thanks for all the suggestions.

Not 100% sure what I'll go for... reason I like the Blackstar is they're bomb-proof (ultra-reliable), no faff with valves and sounds great at ALL volumes. ICBM made a good point that I could use an extra channel for boosted solos though unfortunately that'd render my boost pedal void. Can't be bothered putting some pedals in front of the amp and others in the FX loop - too much faff for me. This is a real bummer for me as I really wanted the boost pedal to function as my master boost.

I'm tempted to keep the 260 at least until my gig on Saturday... when holding it in two hands it's more manageable, but the fact I even have to use a trolley tells me it's a bit too heavy for me.

The thought of a really good head and cab sounds very attractive now.

thomasross20 · December 2014

ICBM said:

Be careful about the impedance - the ID really needs 4 ohms to work at it's best. If you were going for a head and a non-Blackstar cab, that's why I would probably pick the 100, to make sure it didn't run out of puff if you use it with an 8 or especially 16-ohm cab.

I agree about stereo being wonderfully lush, but in a stage mix it doesn't really work so well so you may not miss it as much as you expect.

Very good points...

100 probably would be the better bet then. Need to really try the weight - 13kg should be ok (that's what it says it weighs, anyway).

I definitely like having the potential for more loudness if I need it..!

ICBM · December 2014

thomasross20 said:

Thanks for all the suggestions.
Not 100% sure what I'll go for... reason I like the Blackstar is they're bomb-proof (ultra-reliable), no faff with valves and sounds great at ALL volumes. ICBM made a good point that I could use an extra channel for boosted solos though unfortunately that'd render my boost pedal void. Can't be bothered putting some pedals in front of the amp and others in the FX loop - too much faff for me. This is a real bummer for me as I really wanted the boost pedal to function as my master boost.
I'm tempted to keep the 260 at least until my gig on Saturday... when holding it in two hands it's more manageable, but the fact I even have to use a trolley tells me it's a bit too heavy for me.
The thought of a really good head and cab sounds very attractive now.

This is going to be true no matter what amp you use. You simply can't expect to boost the signal going into an overdriven amp and get much of an increase in volume. I have another friend who struggles with this problem too! The only solution if you don't want to use the FX loop and don't want to ditch the boost is to use the amp clean, or very near to it.

Or get an amp with a footswitchable boost - which some amps (eg Mesa) have as a dedicated function, and others can be made to by using the switchable FX loop (with no effects in it), if they have level controls.

How much are you using the onboard effects on the Blackstar? If not, I have an amp you may be interested in… (and no, it's not my spare Trem-o-verb

.) I'll PM you.

thomasross20 · December 2014

Problem is I'd need an attenuator to get decent sounds out of valve heads at low volumes...

paulmapp8306 · December 2014

Valve Amps are relatively heavy - theres no getting away from it Im not big/muscular but Ive lugged amps around for years. Something with wheels helps - but you have that sorted. The lifting is a PITA - but thats what band mates are for if really necessary, a little help.

Hell decent valve power amps on their OWN are around 15Kg+, and thats not racked. My AFX rack, which is a SOLID STATE Power amp, the AFX and a wireless unit - together with the rack itself comes in at 13Kg,

If your that worried about weight, a head and cab might be the way to go. Even then your looking at a fairly small head, and probably limiting to a 1x12 cab. Speakers come in at 3-5 - 4Kg each, so a pair in a 2x12 is going to be around 10Kg+ (with the cab as well), and a 4x12 18Kg or so.

There are GREAT sounding, relatively light heads and cabs, but at a cost. A Suhr Badger and their matching 1x12 is great, but will set you back around £1800. On the cheap end of things - possible a V30 loaded Harley Benton 1x12, and a lunchbox head would work. Anything fro an Orange Tiny Terror, up to something like a Mesa Trans Atlantic (lots of cash for the Mesa though).

OR - just man up and do what every other guitars for decades has done, and learn to lug stuff about.

thomasross20 · December 2014

Suhr Badger / Bogner Atma would be AWESOME.... but not loud enough for gigs, right?

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Amplifier Mistake (Blackstar)

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