The Fractal Thread

mrkb

FM3 firmware 8 now out, which catches up with most of the bigger unit’s functions.

Octavio

How old are the amp models on the FM9? I know there's circa 300, but the company has been around a long time. Is there a section of 'legacy' amps that users don't use? Or did Fractal update them all before the FM9 release

Researching for a friend * ahem *

sweepy

Pretty much all new amps the new firmware and Cygnus revamped most of of them, go on, treat yourself, the new FM9 is probably the best vfm modeller out there, either used as an Fx unit in 4cm or a standalone modeller 

mrkb

They amp models all get regularly updates as the modelling technology used in the firmware evolves. They get remeasured and tuned in against the latest firmware. Fractal is the most active in keeping their technology updated.

Roland

Octavio said:

How old are the amp models on the FM9? I know there's circa 300, but the company has been around a long time. Is there a section of 'legacy' amps that users don't use? Or did Fractal update them all before the FM9 release

Fractal owns a number of classic amps which Cliff Chase measures. It also borrows amps for measurement. A lot of amps will have been re-measured for the current firmware release, but obviously not all of them.

Octavio said:

Researching for a friend * ahem *

There are two FM9 Turbos in the Classifieds at the moment. Buy one and try. If things don’t work out then you can recycle through the Classifieds.

Gadget

Roland said:

Octavio said:

How old are the amp models on the FM9? I know there's circa 300, but the company has been around a long time. Is there a section of 'legacy' amps that users don't use? Or did Fractal update them all before the FM9 release

Fractal owns a number of classic amps which Cliff Chase measures. It also borrows amps for measurement. A lot of amps will have been re-measured for the current firmware release, but obviously not all of them.

Re-mastered, rather than re-measured, and all the amps have been done except FA's own 'imagined' FAS models.

Octavio

What's with the FM9 'MKII' Turbo? Looks the exact same and I thought the Turbo was a recent release anyway. More processing power?

mrkb

Octavio said:

What's with the FM9 'MKII' Turbo? Looks the exact same and I thought the Turbo was a recent release anyway. More processing power?

Same processing power, just slightly bigger scribble strip windows.

Roland

Something I discovered back in the Ultra days was that changes in amp modelling often brought more clarity, and lead me to remove little tricks that I’d been using. That hasn’t happened for several years. This afternoon I’ve upgraded to 25.1. Yes I know that the latest firmware is 25.2, but it doesn’t contain anything I need. I spent a couple of hours going through our setlist, checking the patches. The only change I’ve made is to remove some EQ boosts around 1kHz which I’d been using to help cut through. Remember that I’m only using the Vibroverb AMP type, so my experience may be different from other users. 

There’s been talk about a new Vox amp model. When I next get some time, ie when it’s raining and I can’t get out in the garden, I’ll play around with it.

Nerine

It’s very difficult to fault the FM9. 

I think it’s the best solution available. 

I’ll have another one at some point. 

thomasw88

Nerine said:

It’s very difficult to fault the FM9. 

I think it’s the best solution available. 

I’ll have another one at some point. 

Hypothetically,  Would you use it in 4cm or as an all in one?  Your thread about why you went back to amp/pedalboard resonated a lot with me.  I’m currently on a helix lt and there’s a lot I like about it. It’s easy to use, it does sound good and there’s a lot of options.

However,  the drives , modulation and delays pedals don’t sound as good as my pedalboard which is a problem .   I’m spending ages at home tweaking a basic patch trying to emulate my pedalboard and it’s not working so far.   Would the fm3 or possibly fm9 be that much better?   

Roland

thomasw88 said:

Hypothetically,  Would you use it in 4cm or as an all in one?  Your thread about why you went back to amp/pedalboard resonated a lot with me.  I’m currently on a helix lt and there’s a lot I like about it. It’s easy to use, it does sound good and there’s a lot of options.

However,  the drives , modulation and delays pedals don’t sound as good as my pedalboard which is a problem .   I’m spending ages at home tweaking a basic patch trying to emulate my pedalboard and it’s not working so far.   Would the fm3 or possibly fm9 be that much better?   

For me the days of 4cm went out as soon as I switched to Fractal. Once you put the guitar in a band mix the differences between modelling and valves become irrelevant. I’m not saying that they don’t exist. For some styles of playing they’re not noticeable, and where they are noticeable to the player they’re not noticeable to the audience.

When it comes to sitting at home tweaking models to match pedals you will always notice slight differences. The same happens if you compare two tubescreamer pedals, particularly the older ones where components have aged, or were less consistent in the first place. The delays and modulation in the FM9 are very high quality, and there are lots of them. Whether you prefer a particular model to a particular pedal is personal choice.

Nerine

thomasw88 said:

Nerine said:

It’s very difficult to fault the FM9. 

I think it’s the best solution available. 

I’ll have another one at some point. 

Hypothetically,  Would you use it in 4cm or as an all in one?  Your thread about why you went back to amp/pedalboard resonated a lot with me.  I’m currently on a helix lt and there’s a lot I like about it. It’s easy to use, it does sound good and there’s a lot of options.

However,  the drives , modulation and delays pedals don’t sound as good as my pedalboard which is a problem .   I’m spending ages at home tweaking a basic patch trying to emulate my pedalboard and it’s not working so far.   Would the fm3 or possibly fm9 be that much better?   

I tried the FM9 in 4CM a few times and honestly I thought my pedalboard sounded better in that scenario. Everything just kinda sounded less present and direct in comparison to my analogue board. 

paulmapp8306

Im revisiting this a lot.

the "front of amp" FX dont have the same impedances as real pedals, nor do they interreact with the guitars impedance as well.  sonically there decent (if not up to the amp sims IMO)  and work just fine in a Fractal only system - in fact Im ow primarily using ONE patch with some drives in cfront (I say primarily - because Im actually using two lol.  One is celan amp - in a pedal platform way, and the other a driven amp with some selected boosts/OD to flavour and provide a lead sound - BUt Im using the first method 90% of the time).

Post amp FX - the modulation s - are really good.  Even the "analogue" delays are decent...if not obviously analogue.

I am - after using Fractals almost exclusively since 2007,  in the process of choosing an amp (1x12 combo) and will then build a pedalboard.  Im NOT dong this because Im unhappy with my Fractal gear, or fed up, or ywant for real valves as such.  Im doing it because my keys/synth rig is complete from what I can tell.  Im happy with my guitars and AFX, and studio stuff.    Im now 57 and I just want a top notch, hand built, point to point anmp with some selected analogue only pedals for pure indulgence.  It will never be used live (in a band context) and only very occasionally in a jam type senario.  Its just for my own pleasure.

I fully intend however, to test the front end FX - drives and compressor - from that analogue rig in front of the Fractal.  Im quite intrigued to find out how much better they are than the digital emulations - and indeed if a hybrid analogue front end into modelling and digital back end is any better in reality to fully digital.

 

welshboyo

I went back to a real amp with FM9 in 4CM (so JVM 410) and whilst it sounded fine, the whole ballache of lugging an amp around, dealing with venue to venue tone inconsistencies and general louder onstage volumes I've now gone back to FM9 only and the JVM is gathering dust again!!!

IMO, its pointless trying to exactly emulate a pedalboard into a real amp as you have all the impedance discrepancies, patch cable tone-loss, longer cable tone-loss and not all pedals sound the same...neither do the amp models or components etc.

4CM with FM9 is perfectly adequate and unless you have the hearing of a bat then in general there is not a massive difference..

DavusPG

welshboyo said:

I went back to a real amp with FM9 in 4CM (so JVM 410) and whilst it sounded fine, the whole ballache of lugging an amp around, dealing with venue to venue tone inconsistencies and general louder onstage volumes I've now gone back to FM9 only and the JVM is gathering dust again!!!

I did exactly the same a couple of years ago - gigging my FM9 in 4CM with a valve head and the additional aggro just wasn't worth it. In a band mix the difference wasn't noticeable at all, and to my ears was only slight in isolation. Neither necessarily better than the other, just different.