The Last Jedi spoliers thread

quarky

joneve said:

welshboyo said:

The bit that confused me was after the fight with Snoke/Kylo how the hell did Rey make it back to the falcon so easily, for me there was a whole escape scene missing - or did I drop off for 5 mins?

Yea, that's the one thing that had me like "WTF?"

But I assume Ren let her go, because wants to explore her front bum, and Chewy was probably just casually just waiting in the pick up/drop off spot. 

I think she left on the Falcon while Kylo was still passed out. When she left the Falcon to go down to see Kylo, didn't she tell them to stick around to pick her up or something?

FarleyUK

That battle on Crait...... did anyone else think maybe the Empire / whatever they are now should have brought more troops? Even though there weren't many rebels / whatever they are now left, it just seemed more like a skirmish than a full-on attack.

EDIT - I'm confused about the whole Republic / First Order thing..... the Empire was defeated, so I thought the Alliance was in control? How did they not see the First Order massing etc.? How did they get control back? Why are the Alliance on the back foot again?

joneve

quarky said:

joneve said:

welshboyo said:

The bit that confused me was after the fight with Snoke/Kylo how the hell did Rey make it back to the falcon so easily, for me there was a whole escape scene missing - or did I drop off for 5 mins?

Yea, that's the one thing that had me like "WTF?"

But I assume Ren let her go, because wants to explore her front bum, and Chewy was probably just casually just waiting in the pick up/drop off spot. 

I think she left on the Falcon while Kylo was still passed out. When she left the Falcon to go down to see Kylo, didn't she tell them to stick around to pick her up or something?

Can't recall, but possibly! Would make sense. I need to see it again really! 

joneve

FarleyUK said:

That battle on Crait...... did anyone else think maybe the Empire / whatever they are now should have brought more troops? Even though there weren't many rebels / whatever they are now left, it just seemed more like a skirmish than a full-on attack.

EDIT - I'm confused about the whole Republic / First Order thing..... the Empire was defeated, so I thought the Alliance was in control? How did they not see the First Order massing etc.? How did they get control back? Why are the Alliance on the back foot again?

Maybe that's the point though? they didn't think they needed them because the Rebels were so depleted. I'd have said for heavily artillery walkers and a fuck off space battering ram would have done the trick though! 

english_bob

WezV said:

How did the books get in the falcon at the end?  If Luke put them there, the dramatic scene with the temple loses all impact.  was Yoda just calling his bluff???

I assumed Rey had swiped them before she left the island. Luke did believe they were still in the tree.

Interesting that Force Ghost Yoda was able to create the lightning that burned the tree (or direct existing lightning, or something). I don't think we've seen force ghosts do anything like that before. Interesting precedent...



I really liked The Last Jedi. I'd managed to avoid any plot spoilers, but in my mind I was expecting some sort of riff on the general themes of Empire in the same way that TFA had riffed on A New Hope, setting up Ep.IX as a ROTJ riff. I was surprised to find so many Return of the Jedi callbacks mixed in there with the TESB parallels too, which blows everything wide open for Ep.IX.

I liked that they subverted all the internet speculation about Snoke, and Rey's parentage- it does make sense that Rey's parents were "nobody", which fits with stuff that Abrams was saying at the time of TFA. The Snoke theories irritated me- all of them seemed to depend on knowledge of obscure Extended Universe stuff that would have fallen completely flat for the majority of the film's audience without e x t e n s i v e Basil Exposition stuff, so I'm glad they didn't go with that, although it is a little bit frustrating that we may not get *any* backstory on the guy.

Not sure how I feel about Kylo Ren as the main villain going forward- the tension between him and Hux is potentially interesting (Hux has never had much time for him, but is clearly fully sick of his bullshit by the end), and the fact that he's immature, impulsive, emotionally unstable, laughably easy to provoke with insults, and in charge of a whole shitload of guys with big fuck off guns and planet destroying weapons is very 2017, but I don't know quite how you do Star Wars with that sort of villain rather than the cold, calculating manipulator (Vader, Tarkin, Krennic, Palpatine, Snoke).

Set pieces were brilliant- the bomber sequence seemed very Rogue One influenced, while also being a great introduction to the general "cost of war" theme, the throne room fight was great, and the Crait sequences were excellent, including the unexpected-without-being-totally-ridiculous Luke Skywalker part (with ace "brush off" gag).

Still unsure what the point of Captain Phasma was. I'd say she was wasted, only I don't get what they wanted to do with her in the first place (and why, among all those thousands of Stormtroopers, is there not a single other captain in a shiny suit?). I'm hoping that the time honoured "sneery line followed by long drop in to a fire" exit means we've seen the last of her. 

I wonder whether they debated in post-production whether it was possible to switch Leia and Holdo at the end- it would have been a fitting end that would have made perfect sense given their storylines (although Holdo took her sweet bloody time about it, considering she'd supposedly resigned herself to death already), and would have saved them a bunch of explaining in the first reel of Ep.IX. I admit, that's pretty cold...

Sure, there were a couple of bum notes (Leia does WALL-E being the bummest), but overall it was pretty good, and leaves me with no idea how they're going to start Ep.IX, let alone finish it.

FarleyUK

Yeah, but the other thing, now I think about it..... you mean to tell me the First order only have a single squadron of Star Destroyers? They couldn't send a message to other ships and ask them to warp in and assist?

Jalapeno

The Books, I must've missed that but I was dying for a pee by then.

I'd assume Rey had legged it while Ken was having a nap.

quarky

FarleyUK said:

EDIT - I'm confused about the whole Republic / First Order thing..... the Empire was defeated, so I thought the Alliance was in control? How did they not see the First Order massing etc.? How did they get control back? Why are the Alliance on the back foot again?

I guess with space being so big, the Republic knew they were still around, but didn't realise how much they had grown. Perhaps because the Republic were dealing with internal crap? 

english_bob

FarleyUK said:

Yeah, but the other thing, now I think about it..... you mean to tell me the First order only have a single squadron of Star Destroyers? They couldn't send a message to other ships and ask them to warp in and assist?

We don't really know very much about the First Order, at least not from the films- there might be other material you can buy that fills in the gaps if you feel like fattening Disney's pockets, but it's equally possible that the ships we saw are the whole fleet (in which case they're fucked at the end), or that they're a fraction of what they had.

But yeah, even if those were all the ships they had, why not split them up and send a few ahead of the Resistance ships to cut them off? They still had them massively outnumbered and outgunned.

The Dreadnought captain's grumble in the opening battle about launching his fighters "five bloody minutes ago" seems to suggest that there's some stupidly rigid chain of command that demands that the commander of the entire force (Hux) has to specifically instruct his officers to scratch their own arses.

Or, you know, plot holes.

munckee

FarleyUK said:

Yeah, but the other thing, now I think about it..... you mean to tell me the First order only have a single squadron of Star Destroyers? They couldn't send a message to other ships and ask them to warp in and assist?

Considering they did have fuel as far as we know, why didnt one star destroyer light space away, then light space back again in front of the resistance ship and then blow the sh1t out of it.  Thats what I would have done...

english_bob

munckee said:

Considering they did have fuel as far as we know, why didnt one star destroyer light space away, then light space back again in front of the resistance ship and then blow the sh1t out of it.  Thats what I would have done...

"STOP TELLING ME HOW TO RUN MY ARMY. YOU'RE NOT EVEN FROM THIS GALAXY"

munckee

I saw it Sunday night, I still can't decide if I liked it or not.  I liked episode 7 and Rogue One.

I watched Once Upon A Time in the West with my 12 year old daughter at the weekend, she thought it was funny but listened to my explanation of the "rules" of spaghetti westerns (always having to face off with the baddie before the gunfight etc) when Luke walked out of the smoke and stared down Kylo Ren she nudged me and said "like a sergio leone film!"

Have I ever been so proud....

bloodandtears

The novel "Aftermath" covers the whole power struggle and transition of the old Empire to the New Order.

The Alliance were still miniscule in comparison to the size of the Empire, despite two death star destructions.

munckee

bloodandtears said:

The novel "Aftermath" covers the whole power struggle and transition of the old Empire to the New Order.

The Alliance were still miniscule in comparison to the size of the Empire, despite two death star destructions.

I can't remember if its family guy or robot chicken when they are on a star cruiser when the 2nd death star blows up and they ask how come they're beaten when they still have a massive star fleet.

Anyone who has not watched the robot chicken star wars episodes should they are the funniest thing ever.  Boba Fett dirty dancing for a frozen han solo made me nearly pee myself laughing. As did Luke filling up at a space filling station and trying not to catch the eye of the now disabled hoth wampa.

bloodandtears

The wampa scene is still Mark Hamill's least favourite storyline

joneve

munckee said:

bloodandtears said:

The novel "Aftermath" covers the whole power struggle and transition of the old Empire to the New Order.

The Alliance were still miniscule in comparison to the size of the Empire, despite two death star destructions.

I can't remember if its family guy or robot chicken when they are on a star cruiser when the 2nd death star blows up and they ask how come they're beaten when they still have a massive star fleet.

Anyone who has not watched the robot chicken star wars episodes should they are the funniest thing ever.  Boba Fett dirty dancing for a frozen han solo made me nearly pee myself laughing. As did Luke filling up at a space filling station and trying not to catch the eye of the now disabled hoth wampa.

Wis. Robot Chicken Star Wars is incredible. 

FarleyUK

bloodandtears said:

The wampa scene is still Mark Hamill's least favourite storyline

.....not after that milking scene it's not.

shuikit

welshboyo said:

The bit that confused me was after the fight with Snoke/Kylo how the hell did Rey make it back to the falcon so easily, for me there was a whole escape scene missing - or did I drop off for 5 mins?

In the dialogue between Hux and Kylo after the the fight, they mention that Rey nicked Snork's escape craft.

Apparently, the original first cut of this film was over 3 hours long, I wonder if it was shown in the original cut.

english_bob

joneve said:

FarleyUK said:

That battle on Crait...... did anyone else think maybe the Empire / whatever they are now should have brought more troops? Even though there weren't many rebels / whatever they are now left, it just seemed more like a skirmish than a full-on attack.

Maybe that's the point though? they didn't think they needed them because the Rebels were so depleted. I'd have said for heavily artillery walkers and a fuck off space battering ram would have done the trick though! 

Also worth noting that Holdo's suicide run really fucked their shit up.

The smaller ships appeared to be completely destroyed, and Finn's duel with Phasma took place in what had previously been a large troop staging area on the main ship. Before Holdo attacked it was full of Stormtroopers and vehicles. Afterwards it was empty and on fire and shit. 

Musicman20

Did the Holdo suicide run literally rip Snoke's ship in two? I watched it in 2D again yesterday and tried to see what it does to the normal Star destroyers.

BTW - I'm more impressed after the second viewing.