Acoustic ingredients for a particular sound?

Andy79

Gandalph said:

Andy79 said:

The VS is like no other ‘normal’ dred, a decent 12 fret is a wonderful thing and entirely different feeling to a standard 14. Trouble is, finding one to try…..

Hobgoblin have a used one in great
condition for a decent price. It's on their website. 

Well spotted. A decent price indeed 

DavidR

Finding a particular acoustic sound @TimmyO can take an awfully long time. So far you have found that you prefer rosewood for the back and sides, and maybe dreadnought size. Here's a few other things you need to decide on and a few factors which will always confound your efforts. P.S. The main thing is the journey.

Other factors (you will need to inform yourself about each one!) - 

* What wood do you want for the top? 
* What shape and size do you want? 
* What price do you want?
* What strings do you want?
* What music will you play?
* Where will you be playing it?
* Do you want acoustic or electro-acoustic?

Factors that will confound you on your journey -

* Tone is subjective, so, with the advice of others, this is a journey you must make under your own steam.
* The tone of an acoustic will alter the more you play it.
* How an individual acoustic sounds will be different when you record it, when you listen to it as you play, and as others hear it when you play it to them. So what, out of those three, do you want it for?
* How many journeys are you having? Along the way you may well discover more than one tone that you like.
* Sometimes players discover predilections for an aspect, or aspects - neck shape, nut width etc. - and these can limit your choice.
* What is comfortable to play will alter as you age.

I am now 68 and I have the following 'tone destinations'. I seem to be quite happy playing any size or shape of instrument but have never like anything electric.

1. Main destination (but now getting a bit too big). Square-shouldered, Sitka topped, Mahogany back and sides, lightweight, mid-price dreadnoughts with Monel strings.
2. Small inexpensive all-mahogany instruments.
3. Cheap Resonators.

You need to develop your own list and then find something that fits the bill. You will make mistakes - everyone does.

There's a large element of luck.

:-)

P.S. You don't actually need to spend a lot of money.

TimmyO

Today I played:

- a 12 fret Dread (round shouldered, slot headstock, Larrivee) - it was cool but not what I’m looking for it turns out
 

- some Brooks (all’s but smaller than ideal I think - 00 ish) 

- a Toon 

- a Larrivee OM-40R

A couple of Audens

A Furch 

The Toon was EPIC 

It was a mistake to play it - it was expensive but brilliant 

The Larrivee OM was next best 

stickyfiddle

Nice. I don't think I've even heard of Toon! 

thomasross20

There was a Toon on sale here recently. Never tried one but heard good things. Danger is have heard good things about a lot of things but until it's in your hands... However glad to hear it was great. 

Tannin

TimmyO said things which amount to:

* I like that wide immersive sound (not a quicker, dryer, more direct sound)
* something that gives up a sound easily rather than needing a thwack. 
* When lightly strummed I like that sizzly harmonic sound

What am I describing?

My new Furch. You have described it very nicely, especially the bit about that "sizzly harmonic sound". It is Sitka Spruce and rosewood. A good D-28 sounds rather similar, but I think you are probably looking at Furch, Dowina, and perhaps Taylor. 

TimmyO

thomasross20 said:

There was a Toon on sale here recently. Never tried one but heard good things. Danger is have heard good things about a lot of things but until it's in your hands... However glad to hear it was great. 

You’ll be glad to know that I really liked the Larrivee OM-40R too - sounded really good - a bit less top end than the others but played brilliantly 

TimmyO

Tannin said:

TimmyO said things which amount to:

* I like that wide immersive sound (not a quicker, dryer, more direct sound)
* something that gives up a sound easily rather than needing a thwack. 
* When lightly strummed I like that sizzly harmonic sound

What am I describing?

My new Furch. You have described it very nicely, especially the bit about that "sizzly harmonic sound". It is Sitka Spruce and rosewood. A good D-28 sounds rather similar, but I think you are probably looking at Furch, Dowina, and perhaps Taylor. 

I’ve had a D28 - not what I’m after this time. 

They had one Furch today - not sure what model it was but it was about 1500 iirc. The Larrivee and the Toon and the Auden were better - wasn’t even close. 

thomasross20

TimmyO said:

thomasross20 said:

There was a Toon on sale here recently. Never tried one but heard good things. Danger is have heard good things about a lot of things but until it's in your hands... However glad to hear it was great. 

You’ll be glad to know that I really liked the Larrivee OM-40R too - sounded really good - a bit less top end than the others but played brilliantly 

I was pleased but trying not to comment lest I flood the forum with Larrivee love ! 

It's a trueism that Larrivee's open up after a year and continue to mature so if that sounded good then it'll even better down the line.

I have yet to try an OM size satin rosewood Larrivee model with original bracing (I prefer original series to 40s, but it's all good, they are popular and I see why).

Maybe a 12 fret moon spruce OO Madagascar rosewood model would be the ticket... Lol...

bertie

Ive been reading things like this for ages- and really quite honestly I hear nothing of any of the things you all describe, or maybe I just dont know how to describe them -  its far far beyond my audial spectrum -   I just know what sounds good to me and what doesnt  and Ive no idea why - Ive literally no idea how to define it, truthfully  -  bass yep, treble, yep  -  upper mids lower mids ? not a fucking scooby 

Not sure if thats bad...........or may be good 

thomasross20

Just stick to one guitar and the music.
That's when I was happiest lol...

guitarjack66

thomasross20 said:

There was a Toon on sale here recently. Never tried one but heard good things. Danger is have heard good things about a lot of things but until it's in your hands... However glad to hear it was great. 

'Why aye man.' (A poor representation of a Geordie phrase!)

ICBM

Spruce top, maple back and sides, preferably maple neck (not fingerboard ). Surprised no-one has mentioned this so far…

The most balanced, versatile combination of woods in any body size.

Also, if this matters to you, a significantly lower environmental impact than either rosewood or mahogany. (Even if the fingerboard is still rosewood.)

Walnut is also good if you prefer a more traditional dark back and sides, and sounds somewhere between maple and rosewood.

thomasross20

@ICBM I know you are a massive maple fan! Admittedly I've yet to try one that grabs me but from what I've tried, it doesn't "colour" the sound and is definitely balanced. Walnut has been hit or miss for me. It's definitely been "dry" to my ear and depending on the type can have mega bass or not much bass. Sounds darker than mahogany and a more even EQ. I think a great walnut is something special, if you can find it!

Tannin

There is no god but Larivee and @thomasross20 is his prophet.

guitarjack66

Larry Vey sounds like a popular Jewish comedian.

Soupman

@Tannin should that be 'profit' ? 
Someone has to keep the company afloat.
 
 

Littlejonny

If you want an immersive sound - I’ve just played on a Furch Green GC-SR …wow. 3D sound!

Littlejonny

Bargain price at Project Music (that’s where I played on it). 

TimmyO

Ok some more data gathered today after a trip to GG Epsom (we were down that way for Claire to go shopping for something and I snuck off for a bit) 

Confirmed: definitely don’t want a Dread however decent - too much if an armful and not responsive enough to fingers compared to the OM sized things (tried a couple of Dreads inc a used D28 that was very nice of its ilk)

Lowden O-something (spruce and Rosewood) - meh. Sounded a bit dead which surprised me - maybe it needs to be played in a bit to do ‘that thing’ they are known for. 

Lowden F-something (a 5k one) - not much better 

Martin OM28 Reimagined - decent but not earth shattering.

Martin SC13 or whatever it’s called - their oddly shaped one. - eek - not nice sounding in comparison to any of the others (but to be fair, less spendy)

Now the fun bit: Atkin (oooooh) 

Frustratingly the Rosewood ones were leftys but the 2 mahogany ones (a Spruce/Mahogany Essential OM and a all Mahogany 000 Dust Bowl 14) were head, shoulders, and large part of torso above everything else. 

I really want to try a Rosewood one now to compare. 

The dustbowl has a very V neck - I didn't play it long enough to.be confident I'd get on with it but it didn't pose an immediate problem. The 45mm but was also very nice for fingerstyle.

The Essential didn't sound quite as standout but the neck was more 'normal'