Buying a car

p90fool

strtdv said:

Emp_Fab said:

Why not diesel?

Because a lot of people here don't like diesel.
The only reasons I can think of not to get one are if you are near an ULEZ, or if you do nothing but short journeys in which case you'll clog the DPF.

Diesel sales are still as strong as ever, and all new internal combustion engine sales will end by 2040 anyway. 

The Honda VTEC petrol engines are legendary for their reliability so the diesels don't look quite as good next to them, but they're still a reliable engine (the 1.7 isn't a Honda engine so I'm discounting that one)

Personally I'd still just get a Golf, but there's nothing wrong with the Honda

With half an eye on resale I think the fact that a lot of people don't like them is reason enough to avoid them, whether those people are correct or not. 

It's a bit like a serial flipper asking on here whether they should buy a sunburst Les Paul or a blue one - there's only one answer really, whatever the merits of the guitar. 

jaytmon

ICBM said:

Emp_Fab said:

Why not diesel?

Because small diesels are shit. 

I agree but this is a 2.2 diesel...unless you’re referring to the car size? 

I would take the Autotrader reviews with a pinch of salt. I’m not saying they’re wrong but I always think owner reviews are of more relevance. Also Honestjohn website gives the 2012 Civic 5 stars.
Avoid that website though - if you read car reviews on there you’ll probably be put off buying any car ever!

Is there a car you’ve always wanted to own but never have, that meets most of your criteria? (And that isn’t an Alfa?!) Why not treat yourself - you can always sell it after 12 months and then go down the reliable Honda route. If you really like the car you’re more likely to be forgiving of any idiosyncrasies. 

ICBM

jaytmon said:

I agree but this is a 2.2 diesel...unless you’re referring to the car size?

Car size. And at 2.2l, this one will be less economical overall and so defeat one of the only remaining points of having a diesel.

Diesel is still worthwhile for big cars for long-distance motorway cruising, or towing, because that's where the advantages of the efficiency and flat torque curve matter.

vasselmeyer

In terms of diesel, the newest "ultraclean" diesels are pretty good in terms of emissions and particulate matter. I've just replaced a 2013 diesel with a 2016 engine and the road tax went from £140 to £20 per year. Occasionally I have to put in an additive Adblue liquid which keeps the particulate emissions down significantly.

The main thing about diesels is that they don't like lots of short journeys as it clogs the DPF. You need regular reasonable length journeys to get the engine up to temperature to burn off the soot.

iseverynamegone

I had an Accord with the Honda 2.2d. 120k and no problems at all. 

Just note the DPF but that’s the same on any diesel. 

LordOxygen

An old 2.2L diesel in a small car = All the drawbacks with none of the positives.
Noisy, smelly, sticky pumps handles when filling up, mediocre economy, a dpf to clog up on short journeys and spendy to service.
Honda petrols are *much* better.

But whatever, best of luck with it.

The Civic's driving position is fine, its just different to low slung alternatives which makes it feel odd to start with. im 6'4 and fit comfortably, can drive for hours without issues.

EricTheWeary

There is loads of headroom in the front of my Civic, although not brilliant in the back. 
A high mileage car bought now isn't going to be worth a lot in a few years so I think the diesel issue is a bit of a red herring unless Emp plans to spend a lot of time driving into big cities. If I was going into London or up the road into Birmingham when it gets a LEZ I'd get public transport which is what it's encouraging you to do anyway. 
My Civic is a 1.6 diesel and it's perfectly happy at motorway cruising, presumably the 2.2 goes like shit off a shovel but isn't as economic or as low emission. But for a car that has the bells and whistles he likes and will be turned into a shopping trolley in a few years I don't see the problem. 

jaytmon

Not sure I follow the relevance of car size.

The equivalent civic petrol engine - 1.8i VTEC is disappointingly gutless (my dad has one) and you’d be lucky to get 40mpg out of it. The 2.2 dTec, is quicker, will give over 50mpg plus tax is cheaper. Granted there’s more to go wrong and fixes will likely be more expensive for diesel but the 2.2 Honda units are supposed to be nicely refined. For an oil burner. Unless you’re doing a lot of stop-start driving in heavy traffic or mostly short journeys, don’t write off a diesel. 

Disclaimer: I drive a petrol car and dislike diesels! 

LordOxygen

my long term average after 23K miles from my 1.8 civic is 43mpg (calculated properly not based on the vague computer) I get 50+mpg on a decent drive of 40miles or more. 

Honda petrol engines have no low torque at all. The power is at high revs only. 

Sesh

Jeeeeeeeez.
I've just read through this entire thread. I'd never heard of tantric car buying. As my old fusion is lurching towards the scrap heap I thought I'd see what people recommend or not. I wasn't expecting a JJ Abrams type of thing where it starts well and then peters to a non-conclusion for evermore. Anyway, I'm hooked and looking forward to season 2.

guitartango

Very lost on this thread, has he brought a car yet or not ? 

mrleon83

I have an older 2.2l Diesel Civic, it's awesome.. you'll enjoy it..

Also, if you want to make it fun (210bhp fun)..

https://www.celtictuning.co.uk/services/performance-stats/honda/civic-mk9-2012-2016/diesel/2-2-i-dtec-147-bhp-2012-2016-ECU-remap-chiptuning/stage-1#t3-content

Bridgehouse

guitartango said:

Very lost on this thread, has he brought a car yet or not ? 

Yes, but it’s not on the road yet as he’s still fitting the laminate flooring in it 

guitartango

Bridgehouse said:

guitartango said:

Very lost on this thread, has he brought a car yet or not ? 

Yes, but it’s not on the road yet as he’s still fitting the laminate flooring in it 

nor the Essex boy go faster stripes

cj73

are we nearly there yet?

shuikit

I've got an older Civic 1.8 petrol (FN2) and tried the diesel 2.2 and thought it was probably one of the best diesels that I've driven, feels a bit more like a petrol to drive than others.  But the petrol was a bit more fun to drive and I was put off the diesel by the many reports of clutch issues in the civic (don't know if they've sorted that in the newer model).  Also I wasn't sure if I did the mileage to make it worthwhile.  I do about 12k miles a year and average around the 40ish mpg on the petrol so think I made the right choice.

Emp_Fab

Sesh said:

Jeeeeeeeez.
I've just read through this entire thread.

There are government funded support organisations that can help you.  You've had a traumatic experience.

LastMantra

I don't think *modern* diesel engines are as bad as what some people are making out. 

My mum has had a massive citroen diesel for years and only uses it for short journeys. Never had it coke up or anything like that. 

ronnyb

LastMantra said:

I don't think *modern* diesel engines are as bad as what some people are making out. 

My mum has had a massive citroen diesel for years and only uses it for short journeys. Never had it coke up or anything like that. 

But if she’s had it for years it probably doesn’t have a dpf or egr.

LastMantra

ronnyb said:

LastMantra said:

I don't think *modern* diesel engines are as bad as what some people are making out. 

My mum has had a massive citroen diesel for years and only uses it for short journeys. Never had it coke up or anything like that. 

But if she’s had it for years it probably doesn’t have a dpf or egr.

Possibly. Not sure.
Never actually seen it happen on any car. Have you?