I'm trying the LCHF (Keto) diet

RaymondLin

Chips, crisps, chocolate, coke cola, cake, tea with sugar, ice-cream, doughnut.

modern diet and its processed sugars are carbs.  Cut it out and you should be half way there.

Dopesick

Another good idea I discovered not too long ago - get a waffle maker.

Then make chaffles - one egg, cheese, almond/coconut flour and other healthy ingredients of your choice. Good for sandwiches, pizzas, burgers, desserts or just to eat on their own.

RaymondLin

Snap said:

Breakfast - eat it. 
You want to manage your weight - keep stimulating your metabolism. Keep it firing. When you miss meals your body goes into storage mode - your next calorie intake is more likely to have more of it converted into fat reserves, ready for the next starvation period.

Eat three good meals a day of proper food. Don't eat refined processed stuff. Drink plenty of water, don't shy away from fats and avoid too much sugar. It's simple, as people keep saying.

This is the keystone of eating properly, all the other diet stuff is fluff and marketing.

The proof is right in front of us in our recent history. I'm 50 and at school there were hardly any fat kids. Go back another generation and obesity was not a significant societal problem.

in the 70s and 80s there was hardly any fast food about. Even less if any in the 60s. There wasn't a great deal of processed food or frozen ready meals etc. Most food was cooked from fresh. People moved around more. I could name the 2 fatties in my school year, even now. Everyone else was lean and fit.

What we hear today from all over the place are a myriad of excuses as to why people can't lose weight - oh, it's genetic, I've got a slow metabolism, I've got a "glandular" problem. For the massive majority of people, none of this applies IMO. If it did, we'd always have had lots of overweight people through the generations. 

Eat properly (problem is so many people don't know what that means), move around. Weight sorted. 

No doubt you will get the people who does intermittent fast coming out and saying that diet works.  Things like 2 day water fast where they just drink water...just to go against the metabolism theory.

Everyone will say something different but I bet you these people who are on these diets, their regular meals, if they can choose to eat what they want when they are not on any diet, are full of crap and alcohol.

TimmyO

Fuengi said:

WiresDreamDisasters said:

Blaendulais said:

TimmyO said:

May be of interest to those not in the thread to just post “see, it seems to me...” ripostes : https://www.artandscienceoflowcarb.com/research/ 

Follow up long term of LCHF.  Like all diets it doesnt appear to maintain healthy weight in the majority of people in the long term.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/31916212

That's talking about a particular variant though - a protein-sparing one. Why the fuck you'd do that in the first place is anyone's guess.

Most variations of the LCHF diet actually emphasize protein intake from what I have seen.

I don't worry about protein particularly, it's pretty consistent for both high and low fat diets generally from what I understand. 

The lower fat your diet, the higher carb and vice versa. 

no - you can consciously increase calories from protein rather than fat. 

TimmyO

WiresDreamDisasters said:

1 slice of thick white Hovis bread is 22g of carbs.

At the extreme end of keto, that's 100% of your carb allowance for the day. As I just found out.

yep - you end up basically bread-avoidant! Same goes for lots of other things that can trigger over eating for some people. this includes most alcohol! 

I do still cheat and hold back some spare calories and have a few rum and diet cokes, or some red wine 

Grunfeld

Snap said:

Breakfast - eat it. 
You want to manage your weight - keep stimulating your metabolism. Keep it firing. When you miss meals your body goes into storage mode - your next calorie intake is more likely to have more of it converted into fat reserves, ready for the next starvation period.

Eat three good meals a day of proper food. Don't eat refined processed stuff. Drink plenty of water, don't shy away from fats and avoid too much sugar. It's simple, as people keep saying.

This is the keystone of eating properly, all the other diet stuff is fluff and marketing.

@Snap - I'm not convinced one can be so dogmatic about this, and I think there's a problem with what seems to be a reductionistic evaluation in your position.

Because I'm not a nutritionist I can't produce a scientific top trumps card.  All I can really offer are my own data and those of the clients and patients I work with.  A lot of my view was informed from watching my friend struggle to keep her eyesight and kidneys in the face of T1 diabetes and the experience of her insulin not working as it should, her doctors not able to offer effective correction, and then her choosing a ketogenic diet which stabilised things.

For myself: I shed about 15kg of weight last year with the adoption of (1) intermittent fasting (IF) (which I agree with what someone has already said on here is simply a re-branding of skipping a meal); (2) a low carb diet.  Ironically I'd been working with this method already for a couple of years with people I treat who needed to reduce weight for physical and or psychological health reasons.  But for me the final straw came one day when I was giving the spiel to a fat guy and as I'm talking to him I'm hearing a voice in my head goin, "You're a big, fat f*cking hypocrite.  Telling him about weight loss and you won't even do it yourself."  So (1) and (2) worked well.  I've yet to see any reason why IF should be considered unhealthy; same with low carb too. 

I think there's a significant problem with saying "it's simple."  The physics of weight reduction is simple but that's not the problem. 

The problem is learning the behaviours required to produce the reduction.  Because people with weight problems have a learning history containing complexities of behaviour relating to many aspects of their lives which are linked by all sorts of connections to the actual putting-of-food-and-drink into their bodies.  They can feel unloved, they can feel failures, they can oscillate between "I must lose weight, it's killing me" to "I don't give a shit." 

Gotta dash but just because there is a massive industry which has loads of fluff and marketing doesn't mean it's all fluff and marketing.  When people are trying to learn new behaviours it can be useful to disrupt old patterns.  Also, patterns such as IF are also simple.  Just like 3 meals a day except it's 1 meal a day. 

Snap

@Grunfeld , I agree that there is a mental side to it as well, otherwise we'd all be fighting fit. But, I do think, very much, that a whole industry has built up around various diets and eating plans that is completely unnecessary. 

It really is simple, and I think we are all a bit guilty of dressing the weight management thing up with various explanations and excuses. We don't need to do a ketotic diet, or a paleo diet or a fasting diet or a cabbage soup diet. We need to understand how our bodies react to what we put in our mouths, how much we put in, and how often we put it in.
 Without that, we are on a hiding to nothing.

For example - low carb. Means nothing unless you think about what carbs are, and how some are great, some are terrible. Sugar, bad, fibre good. Flour, not good in excess, brown rice , pretty good.
 Vegetables per se - massive amounts of carbs, but all veg is good stuff. So on a low carb diet in it's broadest terms you'd cut down on all your veg and focus on fat and protein. So, what about your colon in all this, and all your minerals? You'll just bung your gut up with a load of undigested meat and increase your risk of bowel cancer. Nah, you need a good dose of beetroot and spinach, sweet pots in there, some fibrous stuff thrown in for good measure. Now you're talking!

My point is - the principle is simple: we just need to eat properly. The wider point that you are making (I think) is that getting an individual to do this isn't always simple.

Branded diets aren't the answer though IMO, not past the short term.

EricTheWeary

Grunfeld said:

Snap said:

Breakfast - eat it. 
You want to manage your weight - keep stimulating your metabolism. Keep it firing. When you miss meals your body goes into storage mode - your next calorie intake is more likely to have more of it converted into fat reserves, ready for the next starvation period.

Eat three good meals a day of proper food. Don't eat refined processed stuff. Drink plenty of water, don't shy away from fats and avoid too much sugar. It's simple, as people keep saying.

This is the keystone of eating properly, all the other diet stuff is fluff and marketing.

@Snap - I'm not convinced one can be so dogmatic about this, and I think there's a problem with what seems to be a reductionistic evaluation in your position.

Because I'm not a nutritionist I can't produce a scientific top trumps card.  All I can really offer are my own data and those of the clients and patients I work with.  A lot of my view was informed from watching my friend struggle to keep her eyesight and kidneys in the face of T1 diabetes and the experience of her insulin not working as it should, her doctors not able to offer effective correction, and then her choosing a ketogenic diet which stabilised things.

For myself: I shed about 15kg of weight last year with the adoption of (1) intermittent fasting (IF) (which I agree with what someone has already said on here is simply a re-branding of skipping a meal); (2) a low carb diet.  Ironically I'd been working with this method already for a couple of years with people I treat who needed to reduce weight for physical and or psychological health reasons.  But for me the final straw came one day when I was giving the spiel to a fat guy and as I'm talking to him I'm hearing a voice in my head goin, "You're a big, fat f*cking hypocrite.  Telling him about weight loss and you won't even do it yourself."  So (1) and (2) worked well.  I've yet to see any reason why IF should be considered unhealthy; same with low carb too. 

I think there's a significant problem with saying "it's simple."  The physics of weight reduction is simple but that's not the problem. 

The problem is learning the behaviours required to produce the reduction.  Because people with weight problems have a learning history containing complexities of behaviour relating to many aspects of their lives which are linked by all sorts of connections to the actual putting-of-food-and-drink into their bodies.  They can feel unloved, they can feel failures, they can oscillate between "I must lose weight, it's killing me" to "I don't give a shit." 

Gotta dash but just because there is a massive industry which has loads of fluff and marketing doesn't mean it's all fluff and marketing.  When people are trying to learn new behaviours it can be useful to disrupt old patterns.  Also, patterns such as IF are also simple.  Just like 3 meals a day except it's 1 meal a day. 

As a long term fatty I tend to feel that most weight issues are psychological, the number of people who don't realise they'll put on weight if they eat pizza rather than lettuce is probably pretty tiny. I have a memory of someone saying ask a slim person why they eat when they eat and they'll say because they are hungry, ask an overweight person and you'll get this long list about rewards, comfort, boredom,...

Anyway, whilst  I'm on I'll mention my pet hate with diets: TV show diets. There's one at the moment with Tom Kerridge, there have been ones with the Hairy Bikers and others. They all lose weight. Get overweight people on the TV and tell them to do more exercise and eat less and they'll do that. Who wants to be seen as a lazy fatty on national TV?
 Miriam has learned about portion control and only has brown rice now... No! She doesn't want to look like a lazy fatty on television! She's not stupid, she knew she was eating too much before the Endemol researcher spotted her in Greggs.
Barry has learned that if he exercises at least three times each week then...No! He knew he was unfit, he's not stupid he didn't do any exercise how could he be fit!?! Barry has an emotional attachment to food that he is unable to manage that he is temporarily displacing with a fear of public humiliation.Once the camera crew has gone and he gets people writing Oy Oy fatty saw you on BBC2 last night, wobble much on his twitter feed he will be back to eating his feelings and on the way to his first heart attack.       

Grrrr...

RaymondLin

Rule No.1. Before any diet, drink LOTS of water.

Not only it is good for you, it will also fill a void in. your hunger.  If you drink a pint of water before any meals, you will eat less.  In a way it is indirect portion control.

It is not going to hurt drinking more water.  Your skin will be better, you will be more alert, you are going to feel better generally.

tony99

guitarmangler said:

tony99 said:

steak and eggs and eggs and steak, that's what you should have for breakfast

Delicious.

just makin' sure you heard

Snap

EricTheWeary said:

As a long term fatty I tend to feel that most weight issues are psychological, the number of people who don't realise they'll put on weight if they eat pizza rather than lettuce is probably pretty tiny. I have a memory of someone saying ask a slim person why they eat when they eat and they'll say because they are hungry, ask an overweight person and you'll get this long list about rewards, comfort, boredom,...

Anyway, whilst  I'm on I'll mention my pet hate with diets: TV show diets. There's one at the moment with Tom Kerridge, there have been ones with the Hairy Bikers and others. They all lose weight. Get overweight people on the TV and tell them to do more exercise and eat less and they'll do that. Who wants to be seen as a lazy fatty on national TV?
 Miriam has learned about portion control and only has brown rice now... No! She doesn't want to look like a lazy fatty on television! She's not stupid, she knew she was eating too much before the Endemol researcher spotted her in Greggs.
Barry has learned that if he exercises at least three times each week then...No! He knew he was unfit, he's not stupid he didn't do any exercise how could he be fit!?! Barry has an emotional attachment to food that he is unable to manage that he is temporarily displacing with a fear of public humiliation.Once the camera crew has gone and he gets people writing Oy Oy fatty saw you on BBC2 last night, wobble much on his twitter feed he will be back to eating his feelings and on the way to his first heart attack.       

Grrrr...

Eric, I get it. I know I come across as really dogmatic and blunt when it comes to this subject, but it comes from the right place I think. I grew up in a family where eating disorders were present. I lost a very close relative to obesity and I fully appreciate the mental health side of it, believe me. I think the result of this in my life first hand is the root of why I am so on it when it comes to eating well and keeping fit: i've seen the horrible consequences of the opposite and wouldn't want anyone to go through it.

WiresDreamDisasters

I think we get addicted to the feeling of fullness.

Kinda like women who get into brutal insertions. They can't go back to Mr. Bean after that.

Emp_Fab

You know what they say...  Once you go Triple-Stack you never go back.

Emp_Fab

This week..  I have been mostly eating..   meat, eggs and fat.  I've lost all urges to snack and hunger between meals doesn't exist anymore.  In fact, I'm finding it hard to eat breakfast as I'm just not hungry until at least lunchtime.

My energy levels are up and according to the scales, I'm 6lb lighter than I was on Saturday.  That could just be down to water loss or failing to factor in a giant shit.  I can easily drop a six-pounder some days.  Time will tell.

If this works, it'll be the easiest, tastiest diet I've ever been on!

Grunfeld

Snap said:

My point is - the principle is simple: we just need to eat properly. The wider point that you are making (I think) is that getting an individual to do this isn't always simple.

@Snap -- agreed, and that's a good way of putting it. 

 I agree, cabbage soup type diets are not sustainable.  But other ways of eating, other diets are.  Basically their weight reduction phase can be adapted to weight maintenance and sustained in a healthful way.

My philosophy for any kind of behavioural change is to make it as easy as possible. 

I don't discount free will but basically free will is hard work and most of the time we are lazy bastards who run on auto pilot.

Therefore point the autopilot in a new direction. 

For people with weight problems learning how to "eat properly, three meals a day of all the right stuff" is too much like the direction they are familiar with.  They will revert to old behaviour because it will have had decades of reinforcement -- especially because it has often been learned with unpleasant stimuli [using food as a way to avoid those unpleasant feelings]-- and I can guarantee that shit will continue to happen in anyone's life.

But if the new behaviour is say, eat 2 meals a day (not 3).  Or, abstain from pasta, bread, rice, chapatis, potatoes then these are simple rules that autopilots can run on indefinitely. 

That's the gist of what I was thinking at any rate.

west

17 years approx and counting ive have utilised this way of eating / lifestyle and no plans to change . ive tweaked things as ive learnt and gone along in n=1 style , i dont like all the labels but i suppose i eat nose to tail carnivore these days  , ive read the whole thread and some folks have said things i know to be wrong but im not going there as people need to find their own way if they want to plus there are more important considerations for health than food like Light / circadian rhythm for example ...

i try to mix things up these days by doing time restricted feeding. intermitent fasting and one meal a day a couple of times week ....  seafood / fish / offal / meats / steaks eggs /raw grass fed butter tallow lard  aged cheese is hardly restictive and never really hungry so insulin is stable ... 

in the interest of full disclosure im a stone heavier than id like to be ( i did loose 41/2 stone originally and kept it off )  at the mo'  but i like 2 bottles of malbec a week and some single malts on sat / sun so ill live with  that for now ...

Lewy

I’ve had tennis elbow in my left arm for over 18 months now...had all sorts of physio, acupuncture, electro-acupuncture, the works and nothing’s made a difference.

Re-reading this thread I was intrigued by the references to inflammation and aches and pains being reduced. Did a bit more reading about low carb and it’s potential benefits for chronic inflammation. I’ve been giving keto a go for the last 3 days...elbow pain has all but gone. I’m pretty mind-blown. 

I don’t really know or care whether it’s better or worse or the same when it comes to eliciting fat loss, I can open a jar with my left hand again!!

octatonic

Emp_Fab said:

This week..  I have been mostly eating..   meat, eggs and fat.  I've lost all urges to snack and hunger between meals doesn't exist anymore.  In fact, I'm finding it hard to eat breakfast as I'm just not hungry until at least lunchtime.

My energy levels are up and according to the scales, I'm 6lb lighter than I was on Saturday.  That could just be down to water loss or failing to factor in a giant shit.  I can easily drop a six-pounder some days.  Time will tell.

If this works, it'll be the easiest, tastiest diet I've ever been on!

How goes the diet?

WiresDreamDisasters

Mine is going brilliantly. I've only eaten 3 packets of biscuits today instead of 6!

tony99

WiresDreamDisasters said:

Mine is going brilliantly. I've only eaten 3 packets of biscuits today instead of 6!

there's still time, you can do it, we believe in you